Theo Epstein Compensation "Close" For Red Sox And Cubs
ESPN Boston's Gordon Edes tweets that the Theo Epstein compensation deal is "close" to being finalized, with the Red Sox receiving "one quality minor leaguer" from the Cubs. The identity of the prospect is not known, but that's something we can guess about.
If Bud Selig wants to punish the Cubs so that teams are more reluctant in the future to poach executives from other front offices while they are still under contract, then we're talking about Brett Jackson. But Selig likely isn't going to punish the Cubs to that extent, and the Cubs probably didn't include their top prospect on the list of acceptable compensation, so let's just agree now that it's probably not Brett Jackson.
The Cubs have other prospects, though, the kind that would fit into Boston's system of depth. Boston and the Cubs are in the same position as far as a lack of high-end prospects go, but the Cubs have quite a few mid-level prospects who should end up with major league careers.
Baseball Prospectus's Kevin Goldstein ranked the top 20 prospects in the Cubs system back in November. Unsurprisingly, Jackson was first, but we agreed to forget about him. Shortstop Javier Baez came second, as the Cubs lone four-star prospect -- his ETA is 2015, and, like Jackson, the Cubs might not have included such a high-ceiling prospect on their acceptable compensation list. (We don't know this, of course, but for the sake of being realistic, let's run with that view.)
Goldstein then ranks seven three-star prospects in the Cubs' system:
3. Welington Castillo, C
4. Dillon Maples, RHP
5. Matt Szczur, OF
6. Josh Vitters, 3B
7. Jeimer Candelario, 3B
8. Trey McNutt, RHP
9. Marco Hernandez, SS
That seems like a fair place to search for the "quality" mentioned in Edes' tweet. A three-star caliber prospect would work as fair compensation for the Red Sox, in that they get someone who should actually contribute with the Red Sox (or be useful as trade bait at another time), and, while the Cubs and their system would miss the player in question, they still got off the hook easy in a relative sense.
Welington Castillo is a Triple-A catcher; with Ryan Lavarnway around, it's unlikely that's someone the Red Sox were targeting. Maples was a 2011 draft choice. If this compensation is being viewed as a trade, he's not eligible to be dealt yet. If not, he's a 19-year-old righty with loads of upside. Given he hasn't pitched professionally yet, though, he might not be the target even if he is eligible to be moved.
Matt Szczur will be in his age-22 season in 2012, and just finished a stint at High-A. It's likely he'll be back there this year, as he hit .260/.283/.410 in 182 plate appearances. He's a former football player, so he's a bit behind on the development curve (i.e., don't freak out about the fact he'll be 22 in High-A this season), but he projects to be an above-average big league center fielder. Goldstein says that Szczur, "needs to improve his reads and routes," and until his approach at the plate improves, it's tough to know just what he'll end up being, despite his tools. He's a nifty project with upside, though, and the Red Sox might end up needing a center fielder after 2013 anyway.
Josh Vitters is likely the name you know the most from this list. His stock has fallen over the years, as he was drafted third overall back in 2007 and was a top 100 Baseball America prospect three times, but is now considered a three-star prospect. That said, he still shows promise. Vitters hit .283/.322/.448 at Double-A as a 21-year-old, going deep 14 times with 44 extra-base hits in 488 plate appearances overall. Defensively, more scouts than ever believe in his ability to stay at the hot corner as an average defender with a slightly above-average arm."
Jeimer Candelario is a Dominican signing from 2010, and he'll be all of 18 years old in 2011. While he was great in the Dominican Summer League, I have a hard time envisioning the Cubs giving up such a young, high-upside prospect, or Boston targeting that kind of player as compensation. That's just a personal take on what they might be searching for as compensation, though.
Trey McNutt would be an intriguing get. Goldstein ranked him as a four-star prospect in 2011, tops in the Cubs' system -- the only other four-star arm was Chris "Duchess" Archer, and he was dealt shortly after publication in the Matt Garza swap. His velocity dipped last season and his command vanished at times thanks to mechanical issues. Those can generally be worked out, but the fact they exist isn't promising, either. He'll likely repeat Double-A given those problems, but he'll just be 22 years old.
Finally, we've got shortstop Marco Hernandez. He's another international free agent, a Dominican signed in 2009. He played in the Arizona Rookie League in 2011, hitting .333/.375/.486. He doesn't have a ton in the way of projection, but Goldstein says, in a perfect world, Hernandez is "an everyday shortstop, and there aren't 30 of those in the big leagues."
Plenty of upside, plenty of intriguing names, but no hands-down superstar talent. Both sides should be happy about how this worked out if it's one of those names, as Boston would end up with even more in the ways of mid-level depth -- remember, a three-star prospect might not sound exciting, but that's basically the Red Sox system from Blake Swihart (fifth in Goldstein's rankings) to Brandon Workman (#16). More of those guys, either to promote or to deal, isn't a bad thing for this organization.
[Update 10:16 am] Alex Speier tweets that compensation will be a pitcher from the Cubs 40-man roster. That narrows things down even further, and also eliminates every single player in this article from contention.
52 comments
|
0 recs |
Do you like this story?
Comments
Speier chimes in...
#redsox, according to rource, will receive a pitcher from #cubs 40 man roster for theo. Resolution soon.
-Per the Twitter feed.
Cue the “Garza” responses
by South Coast Ghost on Feb 21, 2012 10:18 AM EST reply actions
Speier said it and 23948234234 people on my feed RT'ed it, so it must be true.
@alexspeier #redsox, according to rource, will receive a pitcher from #cubs 40 man roster for theo. Resolution soon. #soxprospects
I am Sandy's bitch
We Are Because You Were
@WadePSU
My guess is Chris Carpenter (unfortunately not the Cardinals version) or Rafael Dolis
Both seem to profile as decent reliever types.
by South Coast Ghost on Feb 21, 2012 10:21 AM EST up reply actions
Carpenter could be potentially exciting
could become very good if he can remember how to throw in the strike zone
He seems almost ready for an MLB pen
Needs to stay healthy and keep his delivery in check, but I like the velocity there.
Dolis seems further away to me, although Kevin Goldstein ranked him higher than Carp in his Cubs’ prospect list this offseason.
by South Coast Ghost on Feb 21, 2012 10:49 AM EST up reply actions
and because they skipped a step
Theo was under contract with the Red Sox, the Sox thought they would be able to match any offer to retain Theo, but the Cubs just went and gave Theo a contract, trying to destroy the Red Sox’s leverage, and just give the sox cash
That might be the worst description of what actually happened ever...
Which is impressive, mind you. Congrats.
I think "poached" is a little strong
We let him go. We didn’t have to do that, might it have led to a strained relationship in his final year? Sure, maybe, but I don’t think Theo would be one to throw a hissy fit and not do his job to the best of his ability while he’s under contract still. The Red Sox gave their OK and Theo left. Poached sounds like one day Henry came into the office and Theo’s desk was empty with a note that just said “Thanks for everything boss, but I moved to Chicago.”
I am Sandy's bitch
We Are Because You Were
@WadePSU
well perhaps, but,
"There was an initial conversation before formal permission was granted," he said. "I can’t go into the specifics of what’s going on."
-John Henry
but
the Sox let Theo interview with the Cubs, because they just thought they could match any offer the Cubs made, but the Cubs skipped a step, and offered Theo a contract, and the Sox couldn’t match it.
no, that's not it
it wasn’t a money issue. Theo had already decided that he was going to be done with the Sox when his contract was up (a year from now). The Sox knew, when they gave Theo permission to interview, that he was most likely gone.
I'm in agreement with wolf here
In my opinion this had nothing to do with the money, Theo just wanted to leave and would not have accepted the Sox offer, there wasn’t any point in being offered the chance to match the deal, Theo was gone one way or another. I think the Sox let him talk to the Cubs with that in mind and I think they knew that Theo would get a contract from the Cubs, because, who wouldn’t (Sean, gizmo, remain seated) want Theo Epstein when he’s served to you on a platter?
I am Sandy's bitch
We Are Because You Were
@WadePSU
I don't see how the Cubs offering Theo a contract
Prevents the Sox from keeping him. They just let him interview at first, they didn’t release him.
Quantum Woodworking: Hand crafted pens, bottle stoppers, bowls and more.
Check out our blog
Also, if the player is on the Cubs' 40-man roster, who would we have to remove?
Lars? Mortensen?
by South Coast Ghost on Feb 21, 2012 11:10 AM EST reply actions
Speier says today pitchers can be placed on 60-day DL
Putting Lackey and/or Dice-K would solve that problem.
by South Coast Ghost on Feb 21, 2012 11:25 AM EST up reply actions
Thought so too
Maybe the CBA changed that. Speier is usually pretty on the nose about this sort of stuff.
by South Coast Ghost on Feb 21, 2012 11:31 AM EST up reply actions
I really hope it's not Szczur
I’ll never be able to fuckin pronounce that.
"I can’t explain what I mean. And even if I could, I’m not sure I’d feel like it."
-JD Salinger.
Funnily enough, Latin does not have a soft C
So “Caeser” is pronounced “Keezer”
"I can’t explain what I mean. And even if I could, I’m not sure I’d feel like it."
-JD Salinger.
by TheLoneDavid on Feb 21, 2012 12:40 PM EST up reply actions
Something like that.
"I can’t explain what I mean. And even if I could, I’m not sure I’d feel like it."
-JD Salinger.
by TheLoneDavid on Feb 21, 2012 12:49 PM EST up reply actions
KAISER SOZE! KAISER SOZE!!
Galactus does as he pleases. Because Galactus is drunk.
Look in the mirror and ask yourself: "Am I a hater troll?"
@#$%ing Twit: @blogtard
OTM | Silver Seven
Great news that we will be getting more pitching, I guess
I was still kind of hoping to get Rizzo back, more for the comedic value of having ultimately traded Casey Kelly and a sandwich for AGon than any belief that Rizzo would be useful as anything other than trade bait again.
Carpenter
Sean McAdam: #RedSoxTalk. Source: RedSox get RHP Chris Carpenter as compensation for Theo Epstein from the Cubs. Took just over 4 mos. to determine.
ive seen reports that the team will get a quality minor leaguer and a major league prospect
pitcher thats on the cubs 40 man roster. = carpernter. so who’s the quality minor leaguer?
by craziness@analltimehigh on Feb 21, 2012 11:38 AM EST reply actions
Carpenter
Pretty happy with that. He’s got some upside, even with his red flags.
by abbreviatedman on Feb 21, 2012 11:39 AM EST reply actions
And it will take longer...
2 ptbnls still need to be hammered out.
I am Sandy's bitch
We Are Because You Were
@WadePSU
Bleah
Carpenter has a 6.52 BB/9 and a 1.14 (!) K/BB in his professional career. I don’t care how hard he throws if he can’t get the ball within a foot of the strike zone.
Whoops, you're right
I assumed the aggregate total on Fangraphs would take the minor league stats into account. Should look more closely next time. :)
Sometimes I get the feeling I will be dead and gone and the Sox and Cubs will be arguing over which robot constitutes an appropriate PTBNL.
I am Sandy's bitch
We Are Because You Were
@WadePSU
Cherington says it'll be decided by the end of Spring Training
He never said Spring Training of which year though….
by South Coast Ghost on Feb 21, 2012 12:02 PM EST up reply actions
Bobby Jenks sent to the 60-day DL, apparently...
… so his utter uselessness is paradoxically useful (or less totally useless).
The Year of Extreme Opinions
BLAAAAAAARGH OMFG SIGN STARTERS!!
I apologize if this post has offended you in any way. Please retroactively ignore it. Thank you for your consideration.
by nuthinboutnuthin on Feb 21, 2012 11:59 AM EST reply actions
As an aside...
… rehabbing-from-TJ Rich Hill remains on the 40-man. Excellent resource evaluation by the Sox (and I mean that sincerely).
The Year of Extreme Opinions
BLAAAAAAARGH OMFG SIGN STARTERS!!
I apologize if this post has offended you in any way. Please retroactively ignore it. Thank you for your consideration.
by nuthinboutnuthin on Feb 21, 2012 7:38 PM EST up reply actions
I think Valentine was saying
looks like he won’t pitch in March, but will in April, and if all goes according to plan, could be ready to join the team at some point in May
For whatever reason, he had an early opt-out date
Sometime in Spring Training from what I’ve read.
by South Coast Ghost on Feb 22, 2012 11:55 AM EST up reply actions

by 




























