Sox Close To Dealing Scutaro To Colorado (Except They're Not)
by Matthew Kory on Jan 20, 2012 5:45 PM EST
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According to Troy Renck of the Denver Post, the Red Sox are close to shipping Marco Scutaro to the Colorado Rockies. What would come back in return is as yet unanswered. The move could be to move salary in preparation for acquiring a pitcher, which would make sense. But, if so, one must wonder, who will play shortstop?
Then there's the haunting specter of Hanley Ramirez hanging over any Red Sox/shortstop proceedings.
Obviously there is more to come on this. Stay tuned.
UPDATE 1: So, you know that whole trade Scutaro thing? Yeah, never mind.
UPDATE 2: A transcript of talks has become available:
Ben Cherington: Hello?
Dan O'Dowd: Ben? Hi. Dan O'Dowd, GM of the Rockies.
Cherington: Hi Dan. What can I do for you?
O'Dowd: I wanted to talk to you about Marco Scutaro... [beep] I'm sorry. I have call-waiting. Can you hold on for a second?
Cherington: Uh, sure.
O'Dowd: Thanks [click] Hello?
Troy Renck: Hi Dan.
O'Dowd: Hi Troy. What's up?
Renck: Not much, just thought I'd give you a call and...
O'Dowd: Sorry to cut you off, Troy, but I can't really talk right now. I'm on the other line with Ben Cherington. We're talking about Marco Scutaro.
Renck: No problem! [rushes to computer]
O'Dowd: [click] Sorry about that. So, Marco Scutaro. Is he available?
Cherington. No.
O'Dowd: OK, thanks. Bye.
Cherington: Bye.
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This makes no sense if there is no other deal. Otherwise our SS would be Punto, Iglesias or Aviles? Something HAS to be lined up, right?
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They would never take that.
at the very least we’d have to throw in John Lackey and Carl Crawford.
by dennet on Jan 20, 2012 6:03 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
I personally wouldn't budge past Scoot and Shoppach
Don’t want the league to think we’re pushovers.
I am Sandy's bitch.
Penn State Forever
I'm just saying
unless there is something else, this sucks
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by Marisa Ingemi on Jan 20, 2012 5:49 PM EST up reply actions
I was refering to my own post
Tulo was just a guess, nothing I had seen suggested it. We were trading a SS and they already had one the world covets.
I am Sandy's bitch.
Penn State Forever
Tulo
never gonna happen haha
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by Marisa Ingemi on Jan 20, 2012 5:54 PM EST up reply actions
they wouldn't have room for Tulo if they got Scutaro
by dennet on Jan 20, 2012 6:05 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
hahahahahahha
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by Marisa Ingemi on Jan 20, 2012 7:17 PM EST up reply actions
Apparently the Rockies were going to play Scutaro at Second.
by aubatron2011 on Jan 20, 2012 5:54 PM EST up reply actions
Thanks... for a second I started thinking... wait, why would they add Scutaro?
I thought we’d never win it all. And then we went down 0-3 to the Yankees in 2004, and I thought it was the end of the world.
Wait ’til THIS year!
I guess their new target is Justin Turner
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by Marisa Ingemi on Jan 20, 2012 5:57 PM EST up reply actions
Tulo is untouchable
Check out my blog at http://conor-soxrox.blogspot.com
so does that mean he was using same thing Braun was?
The 2011 Over the Monster Gedman League Fantasy Baseball Champion
I hate free agency
Does that mean
he’s gonna take down Al Capone??
Galactus does as he pleases. Because Galactus is drunk.
@#$%ing Twit: @blogtard
OTM | Silver Seven
by Bloggy on Jan 20, 2012 9:47 PM EST via Android app up reply actions
Great movie.
Galactus does as he pleases. Because Galactus is drunk.
@#$%ing Twit: @blogtard
OTM | Silver Seven
This is true, but that doesn't mean the price isn't above a given team's ability to pay
I don’t think there’s anything the Red Sox could possibly offer to motivate the Rockies to move their cornerstone.
"Some guy on the net thinks I suck, and he should know - he's got his own blog." - Nick Hornby
"Lex clavatoris designati rescindenda est"
"I have no special talents. I am only passionately curious." - Albert Einstein
by Andrew T. Fisher on Jan 22, 2012 1:04 PM EST up reply actions
Why?
Does he bleed acid? Is he an alien?
"There's something out there, beyond the horizon in the corner of your eye. I'm going to find out what it is."
-Thomas Solomon, Gentleman Adventurer.
by TheLoneDavid on Jan 21, 2012 11:26 AM EST up reply actions
Please no Punto!
I came to peace with him as a defense-first utility infielder, but not as our starting SS.
by South Coast Ghost on Jan 20, 2012 5:49 PM EST reply actions
look at this now….
http://www.mlbdailydish.com/2012/1/20/2721942/colorado-rockies-close-to-acquiring-marco-scutaro
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looking forward to hearing why this move dooms the Red Sox
by dennet on Jan 20, 2012 5:50 PM EST via mobile reply actions
Not appearing that it is happening
But if it did, it would of course depend on a)who would head the depth chart at SS and b)what we do with the moved salary.
I am Sandy's bitch.
Penn State Forever
Hard to tell
But if I had to hazard a guess I would have said a) Nick Punto and b) Oswalt/Floyd, with my money on Oswalt.
by South Coast Ghost on Jan 20, 2012 5:54 PM EST up reply actions
"b) what we do with the moved salary."
My personal bet is that it would have been a conference table personalized clubhouse chairs like they have in the Hall of Justice.
Then our rotation would be:
1) Lester;
2) Beckett;
3) Buchholz;
4) Eye-Roll;
5) Conference Table
Step 3, Profit!
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BLAAAAAAARGH OMFG SIGN STARTERS!!
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by nuthinboutnuthin on Jan 20, 2012 6:22 PM EST up reply actions
Was funny until...
You butchered the underpants gnome reference.
by Z3rogs on Jan 21, 2012 8:08 AM EST via mobile up reply actions
It was more of a commentary...
… on my impression of this off-season’s team construction.
Step 1, replace no starting pitching; Step 2, * shrug *; Step 3 profit.
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by nuthinboutnuthin on Jan 21, 2012 1:50 PM EST up reply actions
Which I suppose is actually not that much worse than:
Step 1: sign expensive stupid free agent contract;
Step 2: watch stupid free agent ridiculously underperform most pessimistic projections;
Step 3: miss playoffs
The Year of Extreme Opinions
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I apologize if this post has offended you in any way. Please retroactively ignore it. Thank you for your consideration.
by nuthinboutnuthin on Jan 21, 2012 5:07 PM EST up reply actions
Scutaro has the key to Fenway. Good luck getting in and playing baseball!
Follow me on twitter @nyybrandonc
Co-Manager/Writer for Pinstripe Alley, Editor/Writer for Blueshirt Banter
You really are bored.
Galactus does as he pleases. Because Galactus is drunk.
@#$%ing Twit: @blogtard
OTM | Silver Seven
That was short lived
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Sort of like my last relationship after I forgot her birthday!
Follow me on twitter @nyybrandonc
Co-Manager/Writer for Pinstripe Alley, Editor/Writer for Blueshirt Banter
Strangely, one of my girlfriends broke up with me the day before her birthday.
by Anthony Emerson on Jan 20, 2012 7:28 PM EST up reply actions
Oh. My fault. My ex broke up with me four days after my birthday
Follow me on twitter @nyybrandonc
Co-Manager/Writer for Pinstripe Alley, Editor/Writer for Blueshirt Banter
What, my dear friend, did you do on your birthday that prompted that?
A little too much drinky drinky, or did your behavior get you tossed from Scores and she found out about it?
I thought we’d never win it all. And then we went down 0-3 to the Yankees in 2004, and I thought it was the end of the world.
Wait ’til THIS year!
Yay for twitter!
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Nice to get here so late that the headline was already invalid.
I thought we’d never win it all. And then we went down 0-3 to the Yankees in 2004, and I thought it was the end of the world.
Wait ’til THIS year!
Ha ha ha!
Well, there is an expression here… Hawaiian Time… everything seems to run just a little slower than the mainland, so it’s appropriate that I was a little late to the discussion. (Not to mention it was still during working hours for me.)
I thought we’d never win it all. And then we went down 0-3 to the Yankees in 2004, and I thought it was the end of the world.
Wait ’til THIS year!
OMG!! What the...
nevermind.
Galactus does as he pleases. Because Galactus is drunk.
@#$%ing Twit: @blogtard
OTM | Silver Seven
The one thing we can take from this:
Where there is smoke there is usually fire. Sox are trying to move payroll.
I am Sandy's bitch.
Penn State Forever
Where there's smoke, there's fire.
But where there’s Twitter, there’s haste.
Galactus does as he pleases. Because Galactus is drunk.
@#$%ing Twit: @blogtard
OTM | Silver Seven
by Bloggy on Jan 20, 2012 7:37 PM EST via Android app up reply actions
Hi everyone. I am bored, entertain me!
Follow me on twitter @nyybrandonc
Co-Manager/Writer for Pinstripe Alley, Editor/Writer for Blueshirt Banter
x
Follow me on twitter @nyybrandonc
Co-Manager/Writer for Pinstripe Alley, Editor/Writer for Blueshirt Banter
x
Follow me on twitter @nyybrandonc
Co-Manager/Writer for Pinstripe Alley, Editor/Writer for Blueshirt Banter
Not working? I stink.
Follow me on twitter @nyybrandonc
Co-Manager/Writer for Pinstripe Alley, Editor/Writer for Blueshirt Banter
Yes, you do,
MFY fan.
Galactus does as he pleases. Because Galactus is drunk.
@#$%ing Twit: @blogtard
OTM | Silver Seven
by Bloggy on Jan 20, 2012 7:38 PM EST via Android app up reply actions
You know what? Yeah I do, what’s it to you!
Follow me on twitter @nyybrandonc
Co-Manager/Writer for Pinstripe Alley, Editor/Writer for Blueshirt Banter
Yes you do
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by Marisa Ingemi on Jan 20, 2012 8:21 PM EST up reply actions
He seems rather entertained
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by Marisa Ingemi on Jan 20, 2012 7:18 PM EST up reply actions
I am not!
Follow me on twitter @nyybrandonc
Co-Manager/Writer for Pinstripe Alley, Editor/Writer for Blueshirt Banter
Yes you are
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by Marisa Ingemi on Jan 20, 2012 8:21 PM EST up reply actions
who is running this team
The 2011 Over the Monster Gedman League Fantasy Baseball Champion
I hate free agency
You
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by Marisa Ingemi on Jan 20, 2012 7:22 PM EST up reply actions
Everyone wishes
The 2011 Over the Monster Gedman League Fantasy Baseball Champion
I hate free agency
thank goodness he isn't Theo
Theo is and was a failure
The 2011 Over the Monster Gedman League Fantasy Baseball Champion
I hate free agency
but as a disciple of Theo
I’m not sure I like him.
The 2011 Over the Monster Gedman League Fantasy Baseball Champion
I hate free agency
After I typed it I realized it was wrong
but you get the point
The 2011 Over the Monster Gedman League Fantasy Baseball Champion
I hate free agency
A two-time world champion failure.
Who signed Millar, Ortiz, drafted Pedey and Lester and acquired Adrian Gonzalez.
Oh, I forgot
Luckity luck luck
by Anthony Emerson on Jan 20, 2012 7:29 PM EST up reply actions
And acquired Curt Schilling
But he steals office equipment, so who cares.
by Anthony Emerson on Jan 20, 2012 7:30 PM EST up reply actions
How quickly we forget...
… so, if the Cubs win a World Series before the Sox, with the way the two teams are constructed today, can those of us that supported Theo through all of this say: “I told you so.”?
I do think we’ll live to regret pushing him out the door here…
I thought we’d never win it all. And then we went down 0-3 to the Yankees in 2004, and I thought it was the end of the world.
Wait ’til THIS year!
Since when was Theo pushed out of the door?
The only one who that’s suggested of is Tito.
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by Ben Buchanan on Jan 20, 2012 10:33 PM EST up reply actions
Seriously?
You think Theo was welcome to stick around before the Cubs asked him to take their job? That’s not the press I was reading. Boston media wanted more blood after Tito resigned.
I thought we’d never win it all. And then we went down 0-3 to the Yankees in 2004, and I thought it was the end of the world.
Wait ’til THIS year!
absolutely I do
I don’t remember the press being negative about Theo at all until the Cubs things happened.
Cubs rumors started in early September/late August.
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by Ben Buchanan on Jan 21, 2012 10:39 AM EST up reply actions
He wont win a WS in Chicago
the league caught up to what made him good.
The 2011 Over the Monster Gedman League Fantasy Baseball Champion
I hate free agency
I'd say he's made better moves for that team this offseason...
… than we’ve seen around here.
Obviously, Boston’s ahead of the game in the talent already on the team, but we shall see.
I thought we’d never win it all. And then we went down 0-3 to the Yankees in 2004, and I thought it was the end of the world.
Wait ’til THIS year!
of course he's also made moves
that have put the Sox in a place where they cannot make moves…so ther’s that
True.
I really hated that John Lackey deal when we made it, but hindsight makes it so much worse.
The Crawford deal, though, I have to believe pays for itself over the life of that contract. I keep telling myself this. Maybe it will become true.
I thought we’d never win it all. And then we went down 0-3 to the Yankees in 2004, and I thought it was the end of the world.
Wait ’til THIS year!
Different situations
Particularly budget-wise.
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by Ben Buchanan on Jan 21, 2012 11:18 AM EST up reply actions
I don't like Cherington
I want Kevin Towers.
"There's something out there, beyond the horizon in the corner of your eye. I'm going to find out what it is."
-Thomas Solomon, Gentleman Adventurer.
by TheLoneDavid on Jan 21, 2012 11:29 AM EST up reply actions
good, he's nowhere near as good as Scoot
by Anthony Emerson on Jan 20, 2012 8:09 PM EST up reply actions
Pomeranz?
How about Scutaro for LHP Drew Pomeranz? While your at it throw in a draft pick or some cash with it.
by Randy1375 on Jan 20, 2012 9:26 PM EST via iPhone app reply actions
He's got some nice looking projections.
Id probably do that deal.
by revived0103 on Jan 20, 2012 10:50 PM EST up reply actions
Yea.
I scouted him when he was at Ole Miss and he blew my socks off. He could be the next Justin Verlander. He needs to learn to control his slider a little more and get some more speed on his 12-6 curve. Besides that he could be 5-Hole starter next year.
by Randy1375 on Jan 20, 2012 10:59 PM EST via iPhone app up reply actions
I would do that two hearbeats ago
They’d never do it though, Pomeranz is worth way more than Scoot.
I am Sandy's bitch.
Penn State Forever
I would do that, why would they?
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by Marisa Ingemi on Jan 21, 2012 3:57 PM EST up reply actions
We've already established...
… that the Red Sox new management paradigm involves thinking outside that restrictive “we need to field an actual major leaguer at every position” nonsense. Luddite.
The Year of Extreme Opinions
BLAAAAAAARGH OMFG SIGN STARTERS!!
I apologize if this post has offended you in any way. Please retroactively ignore it. Thank you for your consideration.
by nuthinboutnuthin on Jan 21, 2012 2:49 AM EST up reply actions
Beginning to feel like this, isn't it?
Reddick played well in RF? Well, we need a bullpen arm. Kelly Shoppach and Nick Punto are available as back up players? Why not save more money playing them everyday? Let’s trade Scutaro and Salty. Tony Reagins got a job as an assistant GM for the Mets? Let’s see if he’ll take Carl Crawford, only this time around, we’ll pay the whole salary…
I thought we’d never win it all. And then we went down 0-3 to the Yankees in 2004, and I thought it was the end of the world.
Wait ’til THIS year!
I sure wish this 12-16 million the Red Sox
are going to give Ortiz was going to starting pitching.
The 2011 Over the Monster Gedman League Fantasy Baseball Champion
I hate free agency
Oswalt+Kuroda on one year deals > Ortiz
Bard to the pen, sign a cheap DH and winter over.
The 2011 Over the Monster Gedman League Fantasy Baseball Champion
I hate free agency
shoulda been done that way
The 2011 Over the Monster Gedman League Fantasy Baseball Champion
I hate free agency
Sentimentally, I want Big Papi on the Sox in 2012.
However, I’d much rather a 2/$20 million deal that looks like it won’t happen now, and practically, starting pitching was a lot more important than the offense he provides.
I thought we’d never win it all. And then we went down 0-3 to the Yankees in 2004, and I thought it was the end of the world.
Wait ’til THIS year!
They should have let him walk
slid Youk to DH, picked up a cheap 3B or play Aviles/Punto there.
Terrible moves this winter. Ben played the Ortiz situation wrong.
The 2011 Over the Monster Gedman League Fantasy Baseball Champion
I hate free agency
I agree
but giving up on the face of the franchise is a bold move and one that may have caused fan-freakout.
but this was the winter you could afford to do it
it cannot get worse than everything that has happened.
The 2011 Over the Monster Gedman League Fantasy Baseball Champion
I hate free agency
You want to bet?
Boston fans can always get more indignant. Still need to sell tickets, and letting Ortiz walk hurts that a lot more than adding a SP.
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by Ben Buchanan on Jan 21, 2012 11:22 AM EST up reply actions
WS win cures all wounds
ask nomar
The 2011 Over the Monster Gedman League Fantasy Baseball Champion
I hate free agency
And even with the most talented team in history, that's hardly a guarantee.
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by Ben Buchanan on Jan 21, 2012 11:23 AM EST up reply actions
better position to in the WS with Kuroda+Oswalt
than Ortiz
The 2011 Over the Monster Gedman League Fantasy Baseball Champion
I hate free agency
agreed
although I think if Crawford had played like his normal self and Ellsbury the same, not having his career year might not think so.
The 2011 Over the Monster Gedman League Fantasy Baseball Champion
I hate free agency
Still say should deal him for Werth
The 2011 Over the Monster Gedman League Fantasy Baseball Champion
I hate free agency
I wouldn't have a problem with that.
Straight swap.
Galactus does as he pleases. Because Galactus is drunk.
@#$%ing Twit: @blogtard
OTM | Silver Seven
And if they don't, then the team faces the risk of losing out on the town's enthusiasm.
This team, as constructed, needs only a postseason run, because we haven’t burned bridges by dumping guys like Ortiz.
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by Ben Buchanan on Jan 21, 2012 11:26 AM EST up reply actions
they are not a playoff team
The 2011 Over the Monster Gedman League Fantasy Baseball Champion
I hate free agency
We'll see about that, won't we?
We’ve got basically the same roster as last year when we missed out by one game playing about 8 wins under our pythagorean record.
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by Ben Buchanan on Jan 21, 2012 11:28 AM EST up reply actions
I cannot see it with the improvements
to TB/LAA/Tex/MFY
The 2011 Over the Monster Gedman League Fantasy Baseball Champion
I hate free agency
The Yankees position players
are all pretty much due for a regression. They are absolutely catchable.
Galactus does as he pleases. Because Galactus is drunk.
@#$%ing Twit: @blogtard
OTM | Silver Seven
rotation will make up for that
The 2011 Over the Monster Gedman League Fantasy Baseball Champion
I hate free agency
Somewhat
But they are catchable.
Galactus does as he pleases. Because Galactus is drunk.
@#$%ing Twit: @blogtard
OTM | Silver Seven
it could
Although you could just as easily see Kuroda as a 4.00-4.20 ERA pitcher in the AL…and you’ve got no idea what Pineda’s going to do as a sophmore
Exactly.
They aren’t locks.
Galactus does as he pleases. Because Galactus is drunk.
@#$%ing Twit: @blogtard
OTM | Silver Seven
Except it could very well not.
Because Kuroda and Pineda probably won’t much outperform Garcia and Colon. Colon is gone, Garcia isn’t going to produce another year like that, etc.
Plus there’s the possibility that Pineda does get hammered by NYS. We’ll see.
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by Ben Buchanan on Jan 21, 2012 11:32 AM EST up reply actions
Not to mention the question of whether Nova just had everybody fooled.
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by Ben Buchanan on Jan 21, 2012 11:33 AM EST up reply actions
I agree.
They’ve definitely made improvements, but we still have to see how this plays out on the field. Lots of areas where there’ll be regression.
Galactus does as he pleases. Because Galactus is drunk.
@#$%ing Twit: @blogtard
OTM | Silver Seven
Definitely played it wrong.
Ortiz shoulda been wrapped up long ago. Just another piece of bullshit added to this shit-show offseason.
Galactus does as he pleases. Because Galactus is drunk.
@#$%ing Twit: @blogtard
OTM | Silver Seven
2/25
Galactus does as he pleases. Because Galactus is drunk.
@#$%ing Twit: @blogtard
OTM | Silver Seven
not when you have 3/5 of a rotation
The 2011 Over the Monster Gedman League Fantasy Baseball Champion
I hate free agency
If you can get him wrapped up early
you can know what you’re playing with.
Giving Oritz a bit of a bump is worth signing Kelly @#$%ing Shoppach or something.
Galactus does as he pleases. Because Galactus is drunk.
@#$%ing Twit: @blogtard
OTM | Silver Seven
but they didn't
they did not play it well
The 2011 Over the Monster Gedman League Fantasy Baseball Champion
I hate free agency
Not disagreeing with you there
that’s for sure.
Galactus does as he pleases. Because Galactus is drunk.
@#$%ing Twit: @blogtard
OTM | Silver Seven
Yeah...but the security of the other year could appease that.
Or, make it 2/26
Galactus does as he pleases. Because Galactus is drunk.
@#$%ing Twit: @blogtard
OTM | Silver Seven
I would not give him more than a one year deal or 2/20
we need Youk at DH, keep him heathy
The 2011 Over the Monster Gedman League Fantasy Baseball Champion
I hate free agency
Agree
as much as Ortiz has given this club, paying a DH 12 million with the current construction of this team is a poor move. Could have rotated Lavarnway, Youk, etc through the DH slot and signed pitching
It would kill me to see Papi as a MFY but not as much as a potential lost season.
guys come and go, you just get over it cheer for the name on the front of the jersey.
The 2011 Over the Monster Gedman League Fantasy Baseball Champion
I hate free agency
I just can't see adding Papi's name to the list of
Boggs
Clemens
Damon
It’s just not right.
Galactus does as he pleases. Because Galactus is drunk.
@#$%ing Twit: @blogtard
OTM | Silver Seven
It happens though
The 2011 Over the Monster Gedman League Fantasy Baseball Champion
I hate free agency
Sometimes it shouldn't.
This is one of those times.
Galactus does as he pleases. Because Galactus is drunk.
@#$%ing Twit: @blogtard
OTM | Silver Seven
cannot run a team with that sort of thinking though
The 2011 Over the Monster Gedman League Fantasy Baseball Champion
I hate free agency
Can't run a team completely without it.
With no salary cap, income is massively important.
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by Ben Buchanan on Jan 21, 2012 11:24 AM EST up reply actions
This
Ortiz can be an ambassador for this club for decades.
Galactus does as he pleases. Because Galactus is drunk.
@#$%ing Twit: @blogtard
OTM | Silver Seven
and an albatross for 2012
The 2011 Over the Monster Gedman League Fantasy Baseball Champion
I hate free agency
Hardly an albatross as a 4 WAR player.
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by Ben Buchanan on Jan 21, 2012 11:26 AM EST up reply actions
its preventing them from filling out the roster
The 2011 Over the Monster Gedman League Fantasy Baseball Champion
I hate free agency
There are many things preventing us from filling out our roster
Ortiz isn’t one of them.
Galactus does as he pleases. Because Galactus is drunk.
@#$%ing Twit: @blogtard
OTM | Silver Seven
* raises hand *
Is it incompetent pitching acquisition and development?
The Year of Extreme Opinions
BLAAAAAAARGH OMFG SIGN STARTERS!!
I apologize if this post has offended you in any way. Please retroactively ignore it. Thank you for your consideration.
by nuthinboutnuthin on Jan 21, 2012 1:56 PM EST up reply actions
That's part of it! You get this:
Galactus does as he pleases. Because Galactus is drunk.
@#$%ing Twit: @blogtard
OTM | Silver Seven
4? Maybe. But 3 hardly seems unlikely.
Really, it largely depends on how you write the narrative re: his wrist over the last few years.
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by Ben Buchanan on Jan 21, 2012 11:29 AM EST up reply actions
We've already shot ourselves in the foot for 2012
Ortiz is hardly an albatross. We’re already looking at a rotation of Top 3/Bard/Kitchen Sink. I have no faith that Ortiz’s contract will in any way shape signing an Oswalt.
Galactus does as he pleases. Because Galactus is drunk.
@#$%ing Twit: @blogtard
OTM | Silver Seven
Cherington has.
He has decided to go this route. Ortiz wanted security. Cherington didn’t give it to him. So…you let the arbitrators decide.
Galactus does as he pleases. Because Galactus is drunk.
@#$%ing Twit: @blogtard
OTM | Silver Seven
they will get burned
The 2011 Over the Monster Gedman League Fantasy Baseball Champion
I hate free agency
Probably.
Because BC submitted an extra 50 cents to his salary and Ortiz went high-ball. Again, blame Cherington.
Galactus does as he pleases. Because Galactus is drunk.
@#$%ing Twit: @blogtard
OTM | Silver Seven
Very smart.
Galactus does as he pleases. Because Galactus is drunk.
@#$%ing Twit: @blogtard
OTM | Silver Seven
If
If it doesn’t, then of course the team submitted low. Have to have some point to bargain from.
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by Ben Buchanan on Jan 21, 2012 11:48 AM EST up reply actions
But it certainly seems like it's heading in that direction
Ortiz coming out saying that it doesn’t look like the deal is gonna get done, etc.
Galactus does as he pleases. Because Galactus is drunk.
@#$%ing Twit: @blogtard
OTM | Silver Seven
When are we allowed to say he should be unceremoniously shown the door?
I’ve seen nothing but incompetence all winter.
"There's something out there, beyond the horizon in the corner of your eye. I'm going to find out what it is."
-Thomas Solomon, Gentleman Adventurer.
by TheLoneDavid on Jan 21, 2012 11:46 AM EST up reply actions
I think you have to give him a complete year at least
As we’ve already seen, nothing is won in the offseason
But you still need to put the team in the best position to win.
I don’t feel he’s done that with the resources available to him
"There's something out there, beyond the horizon in the corner of your eye. I'm going to find out what it is."
-Thomas Solomon, Gentleman Adventurer.
by TheLoneDavid on Jan 21, 2012 11:49 AM EST up reply actions
So let's say he goes through the year, we win 91 games
and get bounced in the ALCS. Is that acceptable? It’s a one-game improvement over what we did last year when we drastically underperformed.
What if we only win 89 games? 85? What is a poor enough performance to get him fired?
"There's something out there, beyond the horizon in the corner of your eye. I'm going to find out what it is."
-Thomas Solomon, Gentleman Adventurer.
by TheLoneDavid on Jan 21, 2012 11:53 AM EST up reply actions
Well I personally doubt
He’ll get fired after one year regardless of the outcome, but missing the playoffs again would not leave a nice taste in the mouth
What if we win 85 games
After Bard works out as a starter and Bailey replicates his career performances over an entire season?
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by Ben Buchanan on Jan 21, 2012 11:54 AM EST up reply actions
If we win 85 games and Bard works out
why did we only win 85 games? Did the rotation collapse? If so, we’ve been calling for Ben to sign more starters all winter, he’s gone. Is it because Valentine sucked? Also on Cherington. If it’s because Gonzo, Pedroia, Ellsbury and Lester all had a crazy snowmobile accident and were all put on the 60 day DL for the rest of the season I might understand.
"There's something out there, beyond the horizon in the corner of your eye. I'm going to find out what it is."
-Thomas Solomon, Gentleman Adventurer.
by TheLoneDavid on Jan 21, 2012 11:58 AM EST up reply actions
Any number of reasons.
Beckett and Ells regress tremendously, Buchholz gets injured again, etc. etc.
Cherington’s actual influence on this particular team isn’t all that large. He’s made the following gambles:
1) That a platoon of Sweeney/RHH will produce as well as Reddick.
2) That Andrew Bailey will work in Fenway
3) That Daniel Bard, Carlos Silva, Aaron Cook, and Vicente Padilla can provide as much value as, say, $5 million in guaranteed would buy.
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by Ben Buchanan on Jan 21, 2012 12:06 PM EST up reply actions
You had me until # 3
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by nuthinboutnuthin on Jan 21, 2012 1:59 PM EST up reply actions
Yeah. She kinda goes off the rails there at the end.
Galactus does as he pleases. Because Galactus is drunk.
@#$%ing Twit: @blogtard
OTM | Silver Seven
We'll see.
Maholm and bust isn’t the best of strategies either. $5 million isn’t much.
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by Ben Buchanan on Jan 21, 2012 2:29 PM EST up reply actions
I see your point...
… and I’m actually capable of dealing with this solution for 20% of our starting pitching.
Forty percent of our starting pitching, though?
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by nuthinboutnuthin on Jan 21, 2012 5:26 PM EST up reply actions
Agreed
But Bob’s right…we’ll see how it shakes out. Not a lot of confidence right now.
Galactus does as he pleases. Because Galactus is drunk.
@#$%ing Twit: @blogtard
OTM | Silver Seven
Of course
The confidence was at astronomical proportions at the beginning of last year and ….well you know what happened then.
Difference is Theo had a track record of brilliance with us
which had most of us ignoring moves that weren’t right for the team because he’s Theo.
"There's something out there, beyond the horizon in the corner of your eye. I'm going to find out what it is."
-Thomas Solomon, Gentleman Adventurer.
by TheLoneDavid on Jan 21, 2012 11:54 AM EST up reply actions
I dunno.
I can’t say that there’s anything I’ve seen all winter that has made me say, “Good show!”
Galactus does as he pleases. Because Galactus is drunk.
@#$%ing Twit: @blogtard
OTM | Silver Seven
Both of the trades in a vacuum were good trades
but they filled holes that he made himself. I can’t imagine that if you packaged Reddick or Lowrie with someone we couldn’t have nabbed a starter. Maybe not Trevor Cahill, but maybe someone like Jason Vargas.
"There's something out there, beyond the horizon in the corner of your eye. I'm going to find out what it is."
-Thomas Solomon, Gentleman Adventurer.
by TheLoneDavid on Jan 21, 2012 11:51 AM EST up reply actions
Well, this is just it.
If they were just “other minor trades” in a, let’s call it, normal offseason, then sure. Fine. Whatever. They’re more shell-game moves than anything.
But on the basis of the needs of this team….
Galactus does as he pleases. Because Galactus is drunk.
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OTM | Silver Seven
It feels like he's trying to prove to everyone how smart he is with that
and Bard never really needed to move to the rotation.
"There's something out there, beyond the horizon in the corner of your eye. I'm going to find out what it is."
-Thomas Solomon, Gentleman Adventurer.
by TheLoneDavid on Jan 21, 2012 11:55 AM EST up reply actions
Well if he's right
Then he just created a young, cheaper good starter out of a very good reliever…..the starter being immensely more valuable.
If not….well
At the cost of not signing a #4 starter
I don’t like the Bard move, but I would not like it a lot less if we had a 4th starter and were doing the experiment in the #5 role.
"There's something out there, beyond the horizon in the corner of your eye. I'm going to find out what it is."
-Thomas Solomon, Gentleman Adventurer.
by TheLoneDavid on Jan 21, 2012 12:00 PM EST up reply actions
Really hinges on that one arm
If Oswalt is brought in then this team is actually constructed fairly well.
Option A: Lester, Beckett, Buchholz, Oswalt and Bard with a decent pen
Option B: Lester, Beckett, Buchholz, Oswalt and Cook/Silva/Padilla and a kick arse pen
Either of those I’d be happy with
This
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by nuthinboutnuthin on Jan 21, 2012 2:05 PM EST up reply actions
We don't really know that.
As far as we know the Sox have no more payroll flexibility. In fact, it seems like that was the way before Ortiz submitted his $16 million.
In that case, we’ve added a few million from Bailey, one million from Shoppach, and one million from Sweeney over the top of baseline $400,000 contracts.
Now, you can argue that having Bard and Maholm is worth that much more than having Bard and Bailey, but I hardly think I’d fire him over it.
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by Ben Buchanan on Jan 21, 2012 12:02 PM EST up reply actions
Blame the entire FO and ownership
Remember they make decisions as a group.
by aubatron2011 on Jan 21, 2012 11:51 AM EST up reply actions
Don't think I'm not
but you can’t fire Lucchino.
"There's something out there, beyond the horizon in the corner of your eye. I'm going to find out what it is."
-Thomas Solomon, Gentleman Adventurer.
by TheLoneDavid on Jan 21, 2012 11:55 AM EST up reply actions
No, but you can have his role diminished as it was with Theo.
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by Ben Buchanan on Jan 21, 2012 12:02 PM EST up reply actions
That's still on Cherington
just tell him “I respect what you’re trying to do, but I will field a better and more lucrative team if I go and do this.”
"There's something out there, beyond the horizon in the corner of your eye. I'm going to find out what it is."
-Thomas Solomon, Gentleman Adventurer.
by TheLoneDavid on Jan 21, 2012 12:11 PM EST up reply actions
Not really on Cherington.
Cherington can’t boss his boss. Henry and Werner can, and Cherington might be able to after some time, but he can’t just make a power play the second he gets his position.
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by Ben Buchanan on Jan 21, 2012 12:14 PM EST up reply actions
It's not a power play if he phrases it like that
It’s a “this will make you more money” play.
"There's something out there, beyond the horizon in the corner of your eye. I'm going to find out what it is."
-Thomas Solomon, Gentleman Adventurer.
by TheLoneDavid on Jan 21, 2012 12:19 PM EST up reply actions
And then he says "No, we're doing it my way."
At most, Cherington can advise if Lucchino is running the show. If he’s not willing to listen, he’s not willing to listen.
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by Ben Buchanan on Jan 21, 2012 12:21 PM EST up reply actions
I can't but John Henry could
If he wanted to. And clearly he hasn’t wanted to.
by aubatron2011 on Jan 21, 2012 12:52 PM EST up reply actions
but you can’t fire Lucchino.
Have you tried a stake through the heart?
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I apologize if this post has offended you in any way. Please retroactively ignore it. Thank you for your consideration.
by nuthinboutnuthin on Jan 21, 2012 2:06 PM EST up reply actions
If I make a poll will you post it ben?
The 2011 Over the Monster Gedman League Fantasy Baseball Champion
I hate free agency
Yes
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by Ben Buchanan on Jan 21, 2012 11:30 AM EST up reply actions
Not voting until we see option 3:
Sign Ortiz, sign one of Kuroda/Oswalt, Bailey never traded for, Bard in the pen. Whomever at #5, I can deal with that now.
That’s the one I’d have voted for. Ortiz shouldn’t have been able to stop us from signing one competent pitcher this offseason, the Bailey move did.
I am Sandy's bitch.
Penn State Forever
I'm saying keeping Ortiz was more important than acquiring two pitchers.
We could have signed Ortiz AND gotten one of those two and that would have been my ideal outcome.
Instead we signed Ortiz and then got Bailey who along with Sweeney will cost us upwards of $4.5M more than Reddick and Bard.
In my mindset Ortiz = neccessary, One Starting pitcher = neccessary, two starting pitchers = luxury, closer = luxury.
So Bailey was an unnecessary acquisition that prohibits us from filling a need. Ortiz was a neccessary acquisition that is prohibiting but we had to do it and there was still room to fill the need.
I am Sandy's bitch.
Penn State Forever
But at the beginning of the off-season they may have those acquistions
built into the budget. They probably had Ortiz somewhere in the 12 million range, and that would might have left with enough left over in the budget to get a SP, whereas if he does come in at 16.5, that wasn’t in their intial budget so they may not have enough money (without moving a contract) in the budget to sign a SP.
by aubatron2011 on Jan 21, 2012 5:59 PM EST up reply actions
If they were operating in a vacuum sure
But they had a telephone in there, one in which they did talk to Ortiz and his agent before offering him arb and knew what he was looking for. The number should not be a surprise.
They just planned horribly.
I am Sandy's bitch.
Penn State Forever
Yes they did.
But to say his 16.5 million asking price, without moving a contract, is not preventing them to sign a SP may or may not be true.
by aubatron2011 on Jan 21, 2012 6:20 PM EST up reply actions
Yeah, but we needed Ortiz back.
We didn’t need Bailey and the nearly $5M that went into that unnecessary transaction, if he weren’t here, we probably have Oswalt and Scoot right now.
I am Sandy's bitch.
Penn State Forever
You could also say getting Ortiz to 10-12 million,
instead of 16.5 million, could have done the same thing.
by aubatron2011 on Jan 22, 2012 10:39 PM EST up reply actions
Sure but we still needed him and not Bailey.
At $12 or $16 he had to come back. Bailey at $0 or $5M in total expenditures still is not necessary if they were building in a manner that seemed even remotely coherent.
So I’m going to blame the unnecessary transaction.
I am Sandy's bitch.
Joseph Vincent Paterno 12/21/26 - 1/22/12 RIP Coach
Penn State Forever
One could argue
that you’re underestimating the impact of losing Papelbon.
Sure, you could argue that
but I would argue you’re overestimating the value of the closer’s role.
"There's something out there, beyond the horizon in the corner of your eye. I'm going to find out what it is."
-Thomas Solomon, Gentleman Adventurer.
by TheLoneDavid on Jan 23, 2012 9:04 AM EST up reply actions
I guess
But the argument that he is not underestimating it can also easily be made given that his statement regarding Bailey not being here has Bard in his place.
I personally do not find it a stretch that Bard could be just as good as Bailey pitching in the ninth.
by The Name is Dalton on Jan 23, 2012 9:09 AM EST up reply actions
I would say the closer role itself is greatly overvalued
And I was eager to see how well Bard or Melancon would do in that role despite not being stereotypical closers.
I am Sandy's bitch.
Joseph Vincent Paterno 12/21/26 - 1/22/12 RIP Coach
Penn State Forever
It's not about the closers role...
It’s about Pap being a really good pitcher, regardless of what inning he pitches. We lost that production this offseason, so calling Bailey an unnecessary acquisition is debatable, even with Melancon.
I consider it unnecessary considering our budget.
With Bard as closer and hell with Melancon added in, plus our plethora of notquitestarters in AAA we could have easily replicated the production of our 2011 pen and have saved $5M. Just because you lost someone expensive doesn’t mean you have to replace him with someone else expensive. Bard and Melancon plus the additions of Tazawa/Bowden/Wilson/Doubront/Hill or without Melancon, Weiland. The makes of another good pen were already in our system, with our budget, Bailey was unnecessary.
I am Sandy's bitch.
Joseph Vincent Paterno 12/21/26 - 1/22/12 RIP Coach
Penn State Forever
Maybe considering mainly the budget,
you’d be right. But you can’t count on the AAA depth to make up for the loss of Papelbon. Maybe Melancon was enough though.
They clearly don't think Bard is closer material.
And maybe that is because Bard told them he didn’t want to close. We aren’t privy to all their conversations, so if it was Bard’s opinion on his not wanting to close, or he really wanted to try starting in ST, they were going to need to acquire a closer in some form or fashion after losing Papelbon .
by aubatron2011 on Jan 23, 2012 11:14 AM EST up reply actions
I know I've posted this before,
so excuse me if I’m being repetitive, but what Bard said (I can’t verify how true it is) is that he initially told them he was interested in starting because he thought it was a sure thing that Papelbon would be back, and then we Paps left, he assumed that they’d probably keep him in the pen to close and he wouldn’t hear another word about it- but they liked the idea of getting him a chance to start.
This isn’t really at odds with what you’re saying at all, just trying to provide some detail.
They clearly don’t think Bard is closer material.
Then they are idiots.
they were going to need to acquire a closer in some form or fashion after losing Papelbon .
If Bard was forcing their hand (which he wasn’t, because he’s had a couple years to do so and has been in the pen regardless of starting opportunities this team has presented to him through many injuries, he’s been a reliever and no reliever would pass up closer money, unless they’re an idiot, in which case, I’m really worried), then they got Melancon and we still had enough depth of pitchers to fill out the rest of the pen without a costly Bailey addition.
I am Sandy's bitch.
Joseph Vincent Paterno 12/21/26 - 1/22/12 RIP Coach
Penn State Forever
Closer money is still nowhere near Starter money.
A,J Burnett and John Lackey are proof of that. If Bard shows he can be a middle of the rotation starter, his value to the team goes up, and his earning potential goes up.
by aubatron2011 on Jan 23, 2012 12:45 PM EST up reply actions
Good closer money is.
$10M for a closer is the EASIEST money in baseball. He has NO idea how he’d be as a starter, he wasn’t good in college, he wasn’t good in the minors and no one has any idea how he’ll be when he has to take 5 mph off of his fastball in order to not explode his arm plus he has to learn how to mix pitches because relieving is different than starter, he has to change his mindset and his mechanics to get this done, those are both major risks that even he can’t predict.
Also, AJ and Lackey didn’t GET their contracts by being middle of the rotation starters, they were #1s and #2s before their latest contracts, do not confuse what they are now with what they were to get their contracts. AJ Burnett use to repeatedly put up sub 4 ERA seasons, being worth 26.8 WAR before signing with the Yankees, Lackey put up 31.8. They WERE very good pitchers, not of the top tier, but up there above middle of the rotation starters.
Any further more, he didn’t force them into a move. No player with his “seniority” and position has even the remotest amount of leverage to force his GM to do anything. If he demanded Ben would just laugh at him, or at least he should have, it’s ridiculous, a guy who could be closer demanding to start. I haven’t gotten a single read on Bard’s personality that suggests that would even be something close to what he would do.
You keep coming up with these “maybe this” or “what if thats” but so far they hugely avoid what is likely, I’m sticking to occam’s razor here, is it more likely Bard is an ass trying to hold his team hostage with terrible leverage, or is Cherington just an idiot in over his head? I go with the latter, it makes a lot more sense, he clearly has no plan.
I am Sandy's bitch.
Joseph Vincent Paterno 12/21/26 - 1/22/12 RIP Coach
Penn State Forever
z
"There's something out there, beyond the horizon in the corner of your eye. I'm going to find out what it is."
-Thomas Solomon, Gentleman Adventurer.
by TheLoneDavid on Jan 23, 2012 8:04 PM EST up reply actions
I come up with"maybe this" or "what if thats"
Because I don’t pretend to be fucking omnipentent of what they are thinking. I don’t have inside information about what happens on daily basis with the Red Sox, so I can only guess what they are thinking. Bard was actually a pretty good starter in college.
by aubatron2011 on Jan 23, 2012 11:20 PM EST up reply actions
But it's so wishy washy
I have no idea what you actually think because you’ve danced a full circle around Cherington protecting him, even at the expense of driving up Bard’s douche-o-meter. What has he done to earn any benefit of the doubt so far?
Was it when he opened a big hole in the bullpen by moving Bard out? Was it when he forced the need to acquire another bat when he traded away our RF and both starting caliber SSs? Was it when he spent our limited money to fill in those holes he made? Or was it on January 24th, only a couple weeks from spring training when he has yet to sign or trade for a viable starting pitcher? The offseason is 3/4 of the way over and he has done nothing to earn anything remotely near the benefit of the doubt that you are affording him. Now it looks like Floyd is our only option and he’s going to cost us prospects AND money and there were definitely pitchers out there that could duplicate his production and have only cost money instead. He “planned” poorly and I think this team will suffer short and long term because of his bumbling.
I am Sandy's bitch.
Joseph Vincent Paterno 12/21/26 - 1/22/12 RIP Coach
Penn State Forever
Do I think Cherington has bungled the off-season?
Yes, but without knowing everything that goes on in the offices I can’t say with certainity that it was only his idea to move Bard to rotation. I really doubt he just just woke up one morning and said “I have a brilliant idea-Let’s move Bard to the rotation!” They obviously had internal discussions with Bard and the rest of the organization and came up with this idea. Remember, John Henry said they make decisions as a group, so it probably wasn’t just Cherington’s idea.
by aubatron2011 on Jan 24, 2012 10:24 AM EST up reply actions
He's the GM of the team
Roster management decisions are ultimately his in terms of the franchise flow chart, they will reflect upon him and he is fireable if this frankenstein of a team fails. John Henry sure as hell isn’t going to fire himself if the team performs badly just because he was part of the group that made the decision, he will fire Ben though. It’s his job and he is accountable for it, if he has no power in the organization, that’s his fault and I’m not going to pitty him for it or spare him because he wasn’t prepared, he’s a big boy in a big boy job.
I am Sandy's bitch.
Joseph Vincent Paterno 12/21/26 - 1/22/12 RIP Coach
Penn State Forever
Ben Buchanon pointed this out to TLD
earlier in the comment thread. At this point in Cherington’s career he can’t really afford to do a power play against the Ownership. If they tell him that they Bard want to Start, he’s basically got to say “Ok, Sir.” He’s a rookie GM.
by aubatron2011 on Jan 24, 2012 12:00 PM EST up reply actions
I don’t recall a moment where Theo appeared to be this weak. And even if it was ownership making decisions for him at least they made good decisions back then, Ortiz, Millar, Schilling. This doesn’t appear to be the same group of decision makers and only one name has been changed.
I am Sandy's bitch.
Joseph Vincent Paterno 12/21/26 - 1/22/12 RIP Coach
Penn State Forever
Actually a lot of names have changed,
Jed’s gone, Hazen’s gone a few others are gone as well. Right now Larry Lucchino probably has most of the power in the Organization, similar to what happened after Theo left, and we all know how that turned out.
by aubatron2011 on Jan 24, 2012 1:42 PM EST up reply actions
Oh ok.
Sorry I thought he was. I remember his name being mentioned for leaving. But Rogue was comparing Theo’s tenure to Cherington’s tenure, and during Theo’s tenure people that might have been more influential in the organization left.
by aubatron2011 on Jan 24, 2012 2:02 PM EST up reply actions
sure but he's the one in charge of making those kinds of decisions
even if he can’t make a power play, it’s his job to come up with a solid rational argument to convince them. What actually goes on behind the doors we can only guess, but if we’re angry about roster construction and need someone to yell at, Cherington makes the most sense.
That's kind of my point.
Do I think Ben C. has some power and is the the focal point of our anger? Yes, but without knowing what happens behind closed doors at their offices on a day to day basis, it’s hard in my opinion to know who’s really in charge. Cherington does have to make a rational arguement for/against moves, but at this point of his carreer if ownership overrules his arguement, he basically has to go with it, because he wants to keep his job.
by aubatron2011 on Jan 24, 2012 1:47 PM EST up reply actions
Have to say
A Saturday morning conversation with some of the old-guard is just awesome – what makes this site truly enjoyable. Like a great day at the bar with old friends
Agreed.
Good times.
And it’s after 12 here, so I can start dreaming of beer without feeling like I have “issues”.
Galactus does as he pleases. Because Galactus is drunk.
@#$%ing Twit: @blogtard
OTM | Silver Seven
Stupid work won't let me.
Galactus does as he pleases. Because Galactus is drunk.
@#$%ing Twit: @blogtard
OTM | Silver Seven
Anyone believe that with the market as stagnant as it is now
That Jackson’s price plummets to a price we might be able to finagle and afford? Who else is going to pay him over $10M for multiple years now? I feel like most teams that are going to make a move because they need pitching have already done so (except for us), and the teams left are ones that would be picking from want rather than need (except us) and might not want to pay a superfluous player what he’s asking. I really see him at the biggest loser of the offseason.
After 2010 Oswalt clearly would have been a better choice, but with one pitcher already on the roster having suffered a back injury in 2011, maybe we might want to go with the healthier option in Jackson who has made 30+ starts every year since 07. If you can get either at the Oswalt price of $8-11M, which would you pick?
I am Sandy's bitch.
Penn State Forever
I think Jackson will be one of the biggest bargains of the offseason
I would probably prefer Oswalt by a bit, but if they’re both the same price, I’d be happy with either. Of just any damn major league pitcher.
I prefer Oswalt over Jackson
because he is short term.
Paying for multiple years of Jackson seems like a bad idea.
The 2011 Over the Monster Gedman League Fantasy Baseball Champion
I hate free agency
I'm thinking this has gone on so long
That Jackson might be looking at the same deal as Oswalt. This offseason has been rough on him.
If you could have either at the exact same contract, which do you take?
I am Sandy's bitch.
Penn State Forever
Jackson
if on a one year deal. I really want this team to avoid giving SP more than 2 year deals.
The 2011 Over the Monster Gedman League Fantasy Baseball Champion
I hate free agency
That's what I'm thinking too.
We really can’t take risks and Jackson might not put up Oswalt’s numbers, but he doesn’t have a recent injury history.
I am Sandy's bitch.
Penn State Forever
I think Jackson should be looking for 2 years
Unlike Oswalt, he’s young enough to go for big money two years from now. If Jackson waits two years, he misses the FA period next year, when the pitching market is insane.
"There's something out there, beyond the horizon in the corner of your eye. I'm going to find out what it is."
-Thomas Solomon, Gentleman Adventurer.
by TheLoneDavid on Jan 21, 2012 12:55 PM EST up reply actions
Looking for and what he'll get are two different things
At this point in the off-season teams have leverage over players becasue they need to find teams.
by aubatron2011 on Jan 21, 2012 1:11 PM EST up reply actions
That wasn't what I was responding to though
"There's something out there, beyond the horizon in the corner of your eye. I'm going to find out what it is."
-Thomas Solomon, Gentleman Adventurer.
by TheLoneDavid on Jan 21, 2012 1:13 PM EST up reply actions
Just saying he's not most likely not going to get more tahn one year from any team.
But than again his agent is Boras, and we all know what he can do.
by aubatron2011 on Jan 21, 2012 1:25 PM EST up reply actions
Once again;
The only way to get a decent return is to trade for decent SP, use cash, prospects and trade the rights to the Cubs compensation. I have already stated my preference for Floyd. Any other suggestions?
would love floyd
The 2011 Over the Monster Gedman League Fantasy Baseball Champion
I hate free agency
It's really quite simple;
The Sox suffer from a plethora of Uncertainty at SP4, SP5, 3B,C, LF and RF and if truth be told, closer. As they are presently put together, they suck. The FO proposes filling the Starting positions from retreads or players from the Pen. Not one position but two. Youk is not healthy, we are a stubbed toe away from Iglesias at short. Is anyone comfortable with Salty and Shoppach platooning behind the plate? Or RF by committee… and lets not forget, Mc Donald will be starting in LF at the opener> Finally How many more dingers will Bailey give up in Fenway than last year in the Oakland Mausolem? Yet The FO is dithering, and Cherington can’t wait for the season to start. 0-20 anyone ?
Catcher - yes
a Salty/Shoppach w/Lavarnway pushing them is just fine by catching standards
a platoon in RF can work fine and put up just as fine a season as Reddick/Drew did last year
LF we are kinda stuck with
Bailey, I’m not worried about unless its injury (someone already pointed out that Bailey would not have given up any more HRs in Fenway)
SP is really the true worry
I like the shoppach deal
I realize im in the minority on that
The 2011 Over the Monster Gedman League Fantasy Baseball Champion
I hate free agency
I like it for this one scenario.
If Lavarnway starts off in AAA hot, and Salty starts the season off hot, with the lack of good catching in the majors right now, if the Sox needed to give up Salty as a part of a package for something, when that time comes they can do it, instead of missing out on making a deal because they didn’t have the depth in the org to pull the trigger on the deal.
by aubatron2011 on Jan 21, 2012 2:23 PM EST up reply actions
Salty won't be traded
Largely because they aren’t going to keep two catchers who hit from the same side when Lavarnway comes. Shoppach is going to be the one not on the roster at the end of the year.
I am Sandy's bitch.
Penn State Forever
Ok. Well my point is still
the fact that adding Shoppach adds depth to the organization, so if one the catchers is needed to be dealt, they can deal one of them. Unlike what happened with this proposed trade of Scutaro, they don’t have confidence in Iglesias, Aviles, or Punto to be the everyday SS so they had to keep Scoot.
by aubatron2011 on Jan 21, 2012 4:38 PM EST up reply actions
Troy Renck saying the deal is back on now
Believes a pitcher is going back, probably Clayton Mortensen.
All this per Twitter.
by South Coast Ghost on Jan 21, 2012 5:44 PM EST reply actions
I think
they’ll sign Oswalt if this happens, and everybody will shut up. I hope it’s someone better than Mortensen though, as his peripherals aren’t very good.
Well, I don't now if I'll shut up
It’ll be nice to finally get some rotation help, but having to dump Scutaro for his salary relief is just sad. It probably signals someone like Punto and/or Aviles as the starting SS, also means a lot of pressure on Iglesias to develop a bat of some kind.
by South Coast Ghost on Jan 21, 2012 5:53 PM EST up reply actions
Yes.
Far be it from me to want my team to not suck. Sorry to have impinged on your exclusive right to be a Red Sox fan.
The Year of Extreme Opinions
BLAAAAAAARGH OMFG SIGN STARTERS!!
I apologize if this post has offended you in any way. Please retroactively ignore it. Thank you for your consideration.
by nuthinboutnuthin on Jan 21, 2012 5:55 PM EST up reply actions
We don't have a chance at the playoffs.
"There's something out there, beyond the horizon in the corner of your eye. I'm going to find out what it is."
-Thomas Solomon, Gentleman Adventurer.
by TheLoneDavid on Jan 21, 2012 8:20 PM EST up reply actions
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