Daily Links - The For The Love Of Everything, Please, Stop Saying Shipping Down To Philly Edition
It's funny when everyone has the same thought at one time. "Hey," everyone thinks all at once, "Now that Papelbon joined the Phillies, he'll have to Ship On Down to Philadelphia! Hilarious! I'm totally using that!" This was the thought that ESPN Boston's Gordon Edes, and the bloggers at Fenway West, the American Spectator Blog and Yard Barker all had simultaneously. Oh, and so did the fine folks at WEEI.com, BoSox Injection, Boston.com, and Comcast Sportsnet Philly. And those are only some of the ones I found with a quick Google search. I fall victim to easy headlines sometimes myself (though I try not to), but if it's the first thought that enters your head, there's a fairly good shot it's the first thought in someone else's too.
Link time!
This past weekend will be remembered for the Phillies poaching of Jonathan Papelbon. Paps departure to the 2-1-5 is both sad and not surprising. There was little chance he would return to the Red Sox without testing what the market had to offer and, as it turns out, the market had a whole lot to offer. MLB Trade Rumors has a rundown of mainstream commentary on the deal which ran the gamut from, "Really?" to "Are you [redacted] serious?" to "I don't love you, you jerk!" And now that I look at it, that last one was actually my grandmother. I wonder why she would say she doesn't love Jonath... oh.
Most of the above criticism could be predicted. The statistical community hated it, while the reactionary columnists liked it. Keith Law of ESPN hated the deal, while Jon Paul Morosi of Fox Sports liked it. Ho hum. One article I didn't see coming though is Jack Moore's piece at Fan Graphs. Mr. Moore, while not stating he liked the contract, made a case for Papelbon as the best reliever on the market which justified it when compared to what they had offered Ryan Madson. Whether that's worth what Papelbon got or not remains to be seen, but if the Phillies were going to (wildly over) pay that much, you'd hope they at least acquired the best player.
Losing Papelbon isn't the biggest problem with the pitching staff. No, that problem would be in the starting rotation. The Globe's Nick Carfardo and Peter Abraham recently looked at different avenues the Red Sox could explore in order to cobble together a starting staff.
Over at Hardball Talk, Matthew Poullot, in light of the recent hirings of managers with no experience, wonders if the Red Sox should consider Jason Varitek for their manager position. That idea has been going around a bit. Even here at OTM in our Armchair GM series two of our writers (not me) recommended the Red Sox hire Varitek as a coach. Of course, as Mr. Poullot notes, Varitek isn't necessarily finished playing yet, which complicates matters. Also, there's the little problem of experience, or more fairly, knowing how to do the job. Just because a player has been around coaching doesn't mean he knows how to do it. Tek has the potential to be a manager, and he might become one some day, but considering what is at stake (the Red Sox season, ~$170 million, Ben Cherington's career, etc.) is he really going to be better than other candidates that the Sox know can do the job?
Finally, if you thought the 2011 Red Sox with their alcohol in the clubhouse, video games, drinking goats blood, selling human babies, and not using coasters were bad, you should've seen the 2004 version. So says former GM Theo Epstein during a naked snake wrestling competition candid discussion in Vermont over the weekend. He was flanked by former enemy and current bosom buddy Brian Cashman who stated his most recent contract with the Yankees would be something he and his therapist would be discussing. Oh, that Cashman. Always the cut up.
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Of course Keith Law doesn’t like it. No honest payroll geek,or stat head would approve of the Papelbon contract. They act like the money is coming out of their paycheck. There is a simple way to assess this. How much has Mariano Rivera meant to the NY’s W/L record since 1996.? By no means do I suggest that Papelbon is as good, in the context of a career,but as for the first 6 seasons, they match up. Philly has realized that it’s not about how much a pitcher gets per inning that counts.,but about how many wins a guy will mean to a team, regardless of innings.The Sox had a built in excuse. Something Pap said years ago about testing the market. Hey,why should they work harder,or be willing to spend more to keep him. They never even called his agent.No matter who closes for the Sox in the future, this outrageous saga will cost the Sox 6 to 10 wins next year,and for many years to come.. Congrats to Philly for not being afraid of what other GMs,or writers like Keith Law will think. Conngrats to Philly for getting it.
that's ridiculous
your statement there basically asserts that every closer in baseball who is not Papelbon or Rivera blows at least 6 to 10 more saves every year than Papelbon- which is a straight up ridiculous assertion.
Ridiculous
It might be an exageration, as Madson blew only two saves last year,but over the last 6 years,it has been Pap and Mo. No one else comes close.
Except those other 8 guys, you mean.
2006-2011
Name, Saves, Blown Saves, Save %
Rivera: 224, 20, 91.8
Bell: 132, 14, 90.4
Nathan: 173, 20, 89.6
Valverde: 209, 25, 89.3
Soria: 160, 20, 88.9
Papelbon: 219, 28, 88.6
Wilson: 170, 25, 87.1
Jenks: 173, 26, 86.9
Rodriguez: 232, 35, 86.9
Hoffman: 165, 25, 86.8
"We’re the Sox. Not Apple Sox. We ain’t no Barbeque Sox. We’re the Red Sox.’’ - David Ortiz
"Philly has realized that it’s not about how much a pitcher gets per inning that counts.,but about how many wins a guy will mean to a team, regardless of innings."
I agree.
Concurrently we must sign Darnell McDonald to a 10yr, $50 million contract because he will motivate the lazy Red Sux to Play Hard Always. His presence means at least 20 wins per year regardless of whether he plays 20 innings all season.
"We’re the Sox. Not Apple Sox. We ain’t no Barbeque Sox. We’re the Red Sox.’’ - David Ortiz
Huh?
That post makes no sense,in context,philosophy, or reality.
He's right. It doesn't.
Galactus does as he pleases. Because Galactus is drunk.
@#$%ing Twit: @blogtard
OTM | Silver Seven
Completely AGREE!!!
most on this particular board have some warped sense of morality and confuse MLB is the NBA with a hard cap (which really is soft, but who is doing the fact checking). Lakers, Celtics, Heat, Spurs and Mavs all use the soft cap. They fail to understand in a pure capitalistic system with no salary cap the money you pay is irrelevant if you make buckets of cash like say the Red Sox, Yankees and Phillies.
Totally agree with you on the paycheck remark. The moneyball geeks have convinced themselves that 1) Oakland has actually won something and 2) its better to win on the cheap v. just win.
Which is effing insane in a country that prides itself on being as pure a capitalistic system as possible.
Truth is Paps is nails, he is nails in big games and the Phillies needed someone to shut down big time hitters in big games.
Great signing by Philly, Paps will be missed. Especially when Matt Capps is as good a replacement as the moneyball faithful are willing to spend money on.
right, what you miss is
that it is a business and they’re not going to let themselves drop below a certain level of profit. Just because it’s capitalism doesn’t mean that it’s reasonable to sign everyone to horrible deals.
And that all these teams
have budgets that they try and stay within. The Sox are just blessed to have one of the higher budgets in Baseball.
by aubatron2011 on Nov 15, 2011 3:52 PM EST up reply actions
No mention of the fact that
SABR is printing 40 issues of the the 80’s “Baseball Analyst” by Bill James?
Concerned about what would happen after the simultaneous nerdgasm by OTM?
Galactus does as he pleases. Because Galactus is drunk.
@#$%ing Twit: @blogtard
OTM | Silver Seven
Curse you, Bloggy!
I was saving that link for later in the week. Yeah, it’s quite a catch. Some amazing reading in there.
Writer at Over The Monster. Follow me on Twitter! It'll be super awesome fun! @mattymatty2000
by Matthew Kory on Nov 14, 2011 1:04 PM EST up reply actions
You still can, man.
I won’t tell anyone that I scooped ya.
Galactus does as he pleases. Because Galactus is drunk.
@#$%ing Twit: @blogtard
OTM | Silver Seven
Truth is
I would’ve put in in there (I try not to save links for later in order to be all timely and such) but it was about 2am and I knew the kids would be up at 7 so I decided to save it.
Writer at Over The Monster. Follow me on Twitter! It'll be super awesome fun! @mattymatty2000
by Matthew Kory on Nov 14, 2011 2:01 PM EST up reply actions
Had my sister-in-law's kids this weekend.
I get what you mean. Trust me.
Galactus does as he pleases. Because Galactus is drunk.
@#$%ing Twit: @blogtard
OTM | Silver Seven

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