How to Fix the Boston Red Sox
by Brandon C. on Oct 13, 2011 1:35 PM EDT
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PrintThe Red Sox are in a period of turmoil, and everyone seems to have ideas about how to fix the Boston Red Sox. I have some ideas of my own, and I'd like to hear what you folks think.
Here they are:
-Let Jason Varitek, Tim Wakefield go for good, offer them other positions on the team.
It's time to let go of the past, and move on to a brighter future. I'm sure it was nice for you to see Wakefield reach 200, and I'm sure Varitek's captain years were great for you. Regardless, there's no place for nostalgia on a team that's trying to restart.
-Trade Kevin Youkilis or Will Middlebrooks for pitching.
I'm sure the Rockies, Athletics, or other teams would be willing to trade for one of the two. The Athletics are an interesting scenario, as Beane's interest in Youkilis is well documented. I'm not big on projecting trades, but would a Youkilis for one of the A's up and coming starters work?
-Find a way to get rid of John Lackey, no matter what.
With Lackey comes a stench of the 2011 season. Lackey does not fit in Boston, and I honestly don't even think it's just about the contract.
-Keep Carl Crawford.
I truly think 2012 will be a huge bounce back season for the lefty speedster. If the Red Sox trade him for another large contract, as a Yankees fan, I will be extremely happy.
-Let J.D. Drew go, re-sign David Ortiz, only re-sign Jonathan Papelbon if the deal is worth it, don't sign a short stop, pick up Marco Scutaro's option.
The Sox have Bard if Papelbon costs too much. Ortiz is a face of the franchise, and despite his recent comments I think the Red Sox and him are a perfect fit. Scutaro is a better choice at short stop than spending tons of money for another player.
-Don't trade Josh Beckett, don't sign Darvish/WIlson, allow the rotation problems to fix themselves, and if not make a deal at the deadline, or sign free agents in 2013.
Beckett being traded would just be a silly overreaction. The Red Sox should avoid large contracts for now, and the 2013 Free Agent class is absolutely outstanding, as will the trade deadline options, so teams can wait it out. Beckett-Lester-Buchholz-A's pitcher-? is a fine rotation.
-Hire Pat Gillick, even if it means losing Ben Cherington.
I still want the Yankees to hire Gillick, even though Cashman is with the team. Gillick is a star, and if the Red Sox hire him I will be extremely worried.
-Hire someone outside the organization for manager, as well.
I'm still undecided if the Red Sox should sign a long time manager, or a first time manager. The Phillies bench coach, Pete Mackanin seems like a good choice, but the Red Sox could also benefit from a manager with experience.
-Be patient, don't panic.
Simple, but important advice. Don't make panic moves based on trying to make up for the collapse. That will only make things worse.
Thoughts? Here are my joke ideas, by the way.
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There's no chance the Sox
Will hire a GM from outside the organization. With managerial search on hold they don’t want re-start the whole process all over again, which they would have to if they hired an outside GM because he would have his own list of guys.
we don't want your help
freakin Yankee.
Nah, I agree with most of what you said. I think Cherington is definitely the GM for now- I don’t really think Gillick even wants to GM anymore. Cherington knows the organization and knows all of the inner workings of what we have going on. The team itself wasn’t awful, and there’s no reason to go blowing up the whole front office. If he looks bad after a while, I doubt they’re suddenly giving him a long-term contract to be GM.
I think Youkilis was very appealing to Beane when he was a young undervalued prospect- now that he’s making a decent amount of money and is well-known, I think he’s probably less appealing. I think the A’s are looking for ways to fill holes as inexpensively as possible until their stadium situation is resolved.
I’d like to see them go for a first-time manager, just because I don’t really like any experienced guys that are available.
I agree with your agreements and with the things you didn't agree with.
Firstly, and most importantly:
YEAH! SHOVE OFF, YANKEE FAN!
Moving on…yeah, I’d be surprised if the A’s were still interested in Youkilis. If it were doable, I’d be down…but probably not.
I agree with dumping Lackey any way you can. I don’t just mean this from my Lackey-hate standpoint…but I guess that does tie into it. John Lackey, right or not, is kind of the face of all the bad feelings around this team. If he goes, everyone breathes a little easier. If we have to eat that contract, well, I guess so be it. But there will be no such thing as a fresh start while Lackey’s on the team.
Also agree with keeping Beckett. He’s too important and dumping him/trading him would be reactionary.
Tek and Wake? Gone. Love ya, but all good things must come to an end. There is no way in hell Wakefield hits 192. I’m sorry…it just won’t happen.
Beckett/Lester/Buchholz/Bedard/someone. Bedard will be cheap and can be very good. If he breaks down…well, he’s cheap. It will allow us to have more depth.
Bring back Papi and Scoot…Papelbon is a mystery. Depends on who else wants him.
Galactus does as he pleases. Because Galactus is drunk.
@#$%ing Twit: @blogtard
OTM | Silver Seven
On Lackey
Pete Abraham says that it seems to him that Lackey was more of the ringleader in the whole pitchers misbehavin thing and, despite might rant earlier about reporters citing sources and whatnot, I’m more inclined to believe the guys who are actually around the team the entire season than I am to believe the random reporters that crowd around when there’s something awful to write about and pretend they’ve been in the know the whole time.
Also, if we need a scapegoat, lets make that scapegoat be the worst pitcher the Red Sox have ever had, right?
No panic!
First thing is no panic, second is David Ortiz, he has to stay. He’s not only the face, he and Pedroia are the heart of the Sox.
This is true
I think the A’s are looking for ways to fill holes as inexpensively as possible until their stadium situation is resolved.
The A’s from what I understand are not spending a lot of money, at all until it gets resolved. Either by a new stadium in Oakland or the Giants stop with their nonsense and let them go to San Jose.
I believe Willingham has said he would like to stay there next year, and the club would like him to stay but they aren’t making a lot of moves until they get it figured out.
by The Name is Dalton on Oct 13, 2011 2:04 PM EDT reply actions
But how do you solve a problem like John Lackey?
Saaaayyy… Didn’t Girardi say you guys were prioritizing starting pitching this offseason?
* obvious shifty eyes *
Tampa Bay Rays Championships: Still Zero
"Playoffs?!? Don't talk about playoffs! Are you kidding me? I just hope we can win a game!"
- Jim Mora, seeing through space and time to describe the 2011 Boston Red Sox
by nuthinboutnuthin on Oct 13, 2011 2:55 PM EDT reply actions
He throws with the wrong arm
If he were a lefty with a 6+ ERA, the Yankees would take on his entire contract to make him a middle innings lefty specialist. Then, if he never threw a pitch for the team, he’d have lots of company (Marte, Feliciano).
Sigh.
Didn't work for Kei Igawa and his 6.66 ERA
Hic sunt fortuna dracones
I wonder what Middlebooks could bring....
Preferably, a up and coming starter….
I think that
Youkilis is the much more likely trade piece, because of a lot of factors. He’s proven, his contract is almost up, and he seems to be a pain in the ass in the clubhouse.
by aubatron2011 on Oct 13, 2011 3:09 PM EDT up reply actions
I really don't think Lackey is going anywhere, and I don't think he should.
Unless he basically single-handedly destroyed the clubhouse, which I doubt, there’s no way we would be moving without paying his entire salary or taking on an equally lousy contract in return.
There’s still a chance Lackey can be a back-end, 4.5-.475 ERA starter. And that’s better than we could get for moving him.
Apparently
he was the ring leader of the clique of pitchers.
by aubatron2011 on Oct 13, 2011 3:57 PM EDT up reply actions
I don't really believe that
Jack McKeon has already come out and said that he used to have to lock the clubhouse because Beckett and Penny would always go back there during the year they won the World Series.
by The Name is Dalton on Oct 13, 2011 4:23 PM EDT up reply actions
The fact that
McKeon said there were two players that he needed to get on about their behavior could show something about Beckett. If it was just Beckett, I would say that he was the leader of the clique, but because McKeon said it was Penny and Beckett, and didn’t say who was the leader of that little group is a sign.
by aubatron2011 on Oct 13, 2011 4:31 PM EDT up reply actions
Fair enough
But if Beckett is that easily corrupted I don’t think it matters if he is the leader of the “clique”. I think the fact that he had already gotten chewed out for this type of thing is a sign. I haven’t heard from any reliable source that there even was a “leader” anyway. Where did you hear that Lackey was the leader of it?
by The Name is Dalton on Oct 13, 2011 4:55 PM EDT up reply actions
Pete Abe
said he heard from sources that Beckett looked up to Lackey and he was the one that poisoned the clubhouse.
by aubatron2011 on Oct 13, 2011 4:59 PM EDT up reply actions
I would be curious to hear more specifics of who he heard it from.
A player? Bat-boy? Coach? We won’t get it, nor should he have to provide it.
And I know your idols don’t have to be older than you by a lot but Lackey is 32 and Beckett is 31 and they’ve both won rings, had success, etc. That is curious to me.
by The Name is Dalton on Oct 13, 2011 5:07 PM EDT up reply actions
I don't know who he got it from
But here’s a paragraph from his case on not trading Beckett:
Beckett looked up to John Lackey and it’s my belief that Lackey poisoned the well and was more the ringleader than Beckett was. Get rid of Lackey what whatever the cost and take away Beckett’s playmate. Get a manager who will enforce the basic rules of conduct. Get a pitching coach who will stand up to him and Beckett will do his job.
by aubatron2011 on Oct 13, 2011 5:11 PM EDT up reply actions
I look at Lackey like
I look at Tiger Woods right now. The dude is a head case and has to many problems to be effective, especially in a big market like Boston. Trading him would be best for him and the team. He could get away from the pressure of Boston and the Sox would rid themselves of a headcase and could find a pitcher that would be better than him.
by aubatron2011 on Oct 13, 2011 5:35 PM EDT up reply actions
The Sox didn't fail to make the playoffs because of clubhouse chemistry
All the stuff about chicken, beer, and video games make a nice story. But they aren’t an explanation for what happened.
I gotta go 'cause I'm probably definitely gonna nod out again.
by Drugs Delaney on Oct 13, 2011 6:18 PM EDT up reply actions
Clubhouse chemistry
wasn’t the main issue that kept the Sox from the playoffs, but it’s part of the bigger picture, and the pitchers seem to be main culprit in that. They were also the main reason the Sox didn’t make the playoffs because they pitched so crappy, therefore one could make the assumption that there was something beyond the chicken, beer and video games that was worse.
by aubatron2011 on Oct 13, 2011 6:43 PM EDT up reply actions
I wasn't say that
Lackey was a head case because of his love of beer, chicken and video games. I was saying that because as he said himself, his life sucked this year. Maybe that will change during the offseason, but if doesn’t than he should be gone for his own good. Because he needs some help.
by aubatron2011 on Oct 13, 2011 7:21 PM EDT up reply actions
I don't buy that
According to many sources, the Sox have always had beer, video games, and food in the clubhouse. For most of the season, Boston was one of the top teams in baseball. Therefore, this cannot be the cause of the slide.
Regarding the weight and conditioning of the pitchers, Beckett has always been paunchy. Lackey lost a lot of weight in the off-season and seemed to put it back during the season (like CC Sabathia). If weight was a problem, you’d expect Lackey to have been better early in the season, when he was lighter. However, May was his worst month by both FIP and ERA.
I gotta go 'cause I'm probably definitely gonna nod out again.
by Drugs Delaney on Oct 13, 2011 7:34 PM EDT up reply actions
Look,
I could care less what they had in the clubhouse. Beer, chicken, videogames, whatever that stuff really doesn’t bother me. Most clubhouses have that stuff. I’m saying that Lackey had some off field problems (his wife’s breast cancer, possible divorce) that he needs to deal with before I think he can become an effective major league pitcher again. He said mid-season his life sucked, and that probably explained why he was god awful this year. If he can’t deal with the off field issues, than maybe Boston is not the place for him.
by aubatron2011 on Oct 13, 2011 7:48 PM EDT up reply actions
I don't disagree with that
However, he’ll be nearly impossible to move after this year.
I gotta go 'cause I'm probably definitely gonna nod out again.
by Drugs Delaney on Oct 13, 2011 7:52 PM EDT up reply actions
People were saying the
same thing about Barry Zito a few years ago yet he was traded and his contract was worse than Lackey’s.
by aubatron2011 on Oct 13, 2011 8:08 PM EDT up reply actions
And don't forget
that Vernon Wells and Alex Rios, who probably had worse contracts than Lackey have been traded as well, after god awful seasons.
by aubatron2011 on Oct 13, 2011 8:17 PM EDT up reply actions
Vernon Wells was traded after posting a 125 OPS+ season.
With 31 HRs & 44 doubles, 2010 was definitely NOT a ‘god awful’ season.
NBA Officiating - Corrupt? Incompetent? Which is worse? Does it matter? It sucks.
Alex Rios was in the midst of a 'meh' season
with a 94 OPS+, when he was traded through waivers. I.E. a mediocre season, not a ‘god awful’ one.
He sucked holy crap toilet water the REST of the season, but Chicago only had to pick up part of his remaining salary for that year. He filled a need for them at the time. He then had a pretty good 2010 (111 OPS+) before sucking again this year.
NBA Officiating - Corrupt? Incompetent? Which is worse? Does it matter? It sucks.
I thought he
had been from Oakland, my bad.
by aubatron2011 on Oct 13, 2011 9:26 PM EDT up reply actions
Buster Olney
talked about Kenny Rodgers, how he was disaster in New York with the Yankees and then they picked up most of his contract and he was good in Oakland. I could see John Henry doing that.
by aubatron2011 on Oct 13, 2011 9:27 PM EDT up reply actions
He was not skinny because of exercise, but as a result of extensive heroin and cocaine usage...
… or so an anonymous source (which may or may not have been my deeply-seated hatred for him) told me
Tampa Bay Rays Championships: Still Zero
"Playoffs?!? Don't talk about playoffs! Are you kidding me? I just hope we can win a game!"
- Jim Mora, seeing through space and time to describe the 2011 Boston Red Sox
by nuthinboutnuthin on Oct 13, 2011 8:05 PM EDT up reply actions
Now THAT sounds more credible
than all the other crap flying around.
After all, I know that if we can’t totally trust your deep-seated hatred for Lackey, what can we trust?
NBA Officiating - Corrupt? Incompetent? Which is worse? Does it matter? It sucks.
+1
Pete Abraham has NOT impressed me this year with the accuracy of his ‘insider’ perspective.
Pretty much all of his ‘insights’ tend to be bandwagon jumps.
NBA Officiating - Corrupt? Incompetent? Which is worse? Does it matter? It sucks.
Pete Abe
or Hidei Watney or any other reporter not just covering the Red Sox, but any team are not allowed in clubhouse during games, so they couldn’t report on the shenigans going on in the clubhouse during games. So to blast them for not reporting on what these idiots were or weren’t doing, during games is not that smart. Have you heard any players come out and deny this stuff was happening?
by aubatron2011 on Oct 14, 2011 11:02 AM EDT up reply actions
Have you heard any player come out and say "Lackey was the ring-leader"?
Conversely to your point, I’ve not only NOT heard any player come out and ‘deny’ this ‘stuff’ was happening, I’ve heard many players confirm this ‘stuff’ was happening – and HAS BEEN happening for years. It was happening all season (even when we were playing .700 ball) and it was happening back in 2004 and 2007 when we won the world series.
Since when is saying one is not impressed equal to “blasting”?
And your own comment puts the caveate on the credibility of Abraham’s claim: “it’s my belief that Lackey poisoned the well and was more the ringleader than Beckett was”.
As you point out – Abraham WASN"T THERE so how the F should he know? To be fair he ADMITS he doesn’t know when he uses the words, “I think”.
But you seem awfully eager to latch onto that. Basically, it is simply a comfortable conclusion to grab onto: The guy we don’t like for his performance failures MUST also be the guy with the worst character flaws.
Fact: WE DON’T KNOW who the ‘leader’ of all the ‘shenanigans’ was (if there even was a leader) and for that matter it is complete speculation that the ‘shenanigans’ had anything to do with the collapse of the RS.
The sooner we stop wasting energy on gossip, smearing and speculation and look to the factual problems of the franchise the sooner we’ll move on.
NBA Officiating - Corrupt? Incompetent? Which is worse? Does it matter? It sucks.
Look,
I’m as happy as anybody to move on from this BS and talk about the factual problems with the Sox. Pete Abe wasn’t in the clubhouse during the games, but he was AROUND the team a lot more than you and I were, so he would have a better feel for what was actually was going on. He did say he thinks Josh Beckett looked up to John Lackey, and yes it was his belief that Lackey was the ring leader, I’m not saying he knows, but he would have a better feel for what was the actual case. My point in moving Lackey is not because he seems to love throw back a few brews, loves fried chicken and play videogames, because he’s just like every other guy. My point in moving Lackey is I think it’d be good for both himself and the Red Sox. He clearly has some problems off of the field that affected his performance this year. If he can deal with those issues during the off-season and become some what effective, which I don’t know if he can, than bring him back. But for his mental health, it might be better for him to be moved. Whether these ‘shenigans’ played a role in the collapse or not, the fact that they are out there means Lackey, because he so freaking bad last year, and Beckett are going to be the targets of the Red Sox fans, not just fans of other teams.
by aubatron2011 on Oct 14, 2011 11:33 AM EDT up reply actions
Read my fanpost
entitled “Yesterday’s Globe Piece” and you’ll understand my real thoughts on why the piece came out when it did.
by aubatron2011 on Oct 14, 2011 12:21 PM EDT up reply actions
I think you look into trading Youk
to a team looking for a 1Bman that can still hit and is not signed long term. Let the dust settle on Pujols/Fielder then make your move. I’d be o.k. with one year of Lowrie/Aviles/Stopgap if the club feels Middlebrooks is ready by 2013
I'd say depends on Papi
because if Papi’s there, I’m probably OK with it- though our team may then become genuinely not very good against lefties- BUT if you replace Papi with Lavarnway and you replace Youk with Lowrie/Aviles/whatever, you’d better find some REALLY EFFING GOOD guys to start games and play right field.
Also...a decent right-handed bat would be nice if there's no Youk.
Or even if there is a Youk.
Galactus does as he pleases. Because Galactus is drunk.
@#$%ing Twit: @blogtard
OTM | Silver Seven
Youk is a very good right-handed bat
Lowrie/Aviles/stopgap is a HUGE downgrade.
I gotta go 'cause I'm probably definitely gonna nod out again.
by Drugs Delaney on Oct 13, 2011 7:36 PM EDT up reply actions
I'm not so convinced
I mean, we’re talking our cleanup hitter most of the year. We’d DEFINITELY need a big RH bat
I know Youk is a very good right-handed bat.
My point was that we already could have used a good right handed bat. If we trade Youk for whatever reason, we desperately need a very good right-handed bat.
Galactus does as he pleases. Because Galactus is drunk.
@#$%ing Twit: @blogtard
OTM | Silver Seven
Meh we can take a downturn with the bats
as long as its not at the expense of fielding and we get pitching in return
Cody Ross
would be a nice platoon mate with Reddick in RF at least with the bat. Cuddyer is a nice bat but a butcher in the field and would likely demand a larger contract.
Bring back Ortiz
Sign Ross/Cuddyer to platoon in RF
Pick up Scutaro’s option, yuck but only for one more year
Swing Youk for pitching
How about Youk for Oswalt
Phills pick up the option, swing Roy to the Sox for Youk to fill in for Howard
Oswalt can opt out of his option year and become a FA
I gotta go 'cause I'm probably definitely gonna nod out again.
by Drugs Delaney on Oct 13, 2011 9:23 PM EDT up reply actions
Don't know if he would, honestly
doesn’t want to play for long and certainly won’t get $16 million anywhere
I get Scoot is not the best SS in the league and is getting older
But yuck"? He was one of our few good hitters down the stretch, and from all accounts is a complete professional and has played through a number of smaller injuries to help the team.
Cuddyer? Isn’t he a less than optimal fielder that might not work well in Fenway’s spacious RF And from some estimates he could get around $10 million a year for 2-3 years. Couple all of that with the fact he is a Type A free agent and that if the Twins offer him Arb. then it costs a draft pick. For a platoon guy.
He is good offensively and a good leader by all accounts so there is that. Not sure it is going to be worth the money he’ll probably get.
by The Name is Dalton on Oct 13, 2011 11:02 PM EDT up reply actions
From what I've read Cuddyer has already had an offer of 2 years/$16 million (Total, not annual)
And it’s going to take a premium on that to get him out of Minnesota where he has been his whole career.
by The Name is Dalton on Oct 13, 2011 11:06 PM EDT up reply actions
Don't trade Youlkalis
Coming off of an injury shortened season, he will have a value right now lower than it has been in the last 3 years. Never sell low.
John Lackey is going to be damned near unmovable. The team will be paying so much of his salary to pitch for someone else and nothing of great use will be coming back for him. The Sox best bet is let him be the 5th starter.
Nothing of great use
maybe coming back for him, I just think that if the owners want to save face, he would be the first player to go. He’s going to be absolutely slaughtered next year at the first home game, not just because of his pathetic performance this year but also he seemed to be one main men in the collapse. I think his confidence is shot and adding on to that his own fans are booing him, that wouldn’t do him any good. Let him go somewhere where the people aren’t as passionate as baseball and re-gain some cofidence if he’s performing well.
by aubatron2011 on Oct 14, 2011 12:05 AM EDT up reply actions
he's going to get slaughtered next year at the first home game?
I don’t buy that. Youk is an incredibly popular player here, next year at the first home game, there will be a very, very loud “YOOOOOOOUUUUUUUK” when he is introduced.
It was
Lackey I was talking about, I should have put his name in there, because he talked about Lackey in his post. I think Youk will be fine. I think he’ll be the DH.
by aubatron2011 on Oct 14, 2011 9:45 AM EDT up reply actions
A few random thoughts; although the roster is fairly set but still time for a cool change and some risk taking
Entertain any and all trade options except for Pedey, Ells, Gonzo, Bard and Lester should be off limits. this team peaked in 2007 and it came close in 2008 since that time they have been a tease – they need to be broken up and try something else. I would be more interested in some new faces and a new approach.
1. Papi/Youk/Lavernway options: I think you wave good bye to Big Papi and as much as I love him I thought that once Manny left he should be shopped too. I think a new model for DH is to have someone that can also play defense – and, Youk could replace him if he is not traded, although I think he should be traded too. Can Lavernway DH? Is that a possibility? I do not know alot about him apart from his obvious power…is there a pitch that is cryptonite?
2. Lackey: See Barry Zito
3. Crawford: Like it or not, he should/might be ought to, hopefully be decent next year – or, see Alfonso Soriono
4. Resign Scutaro
5. Papelbon: Let him walk sinve the price will probably be crazy…but, is there a better closer option than Bard or Jenks on the free agent market??? He might stay…
6. RF: Is Reddick the answer? I think he gets a nod for the whole season in RF but time will tell…
7. Time for Wakefield and Tek to retire send them off with a great fan appreciation day at the Fens
8. Sign a new 4 and 5 starter I like Bedard (he might be serviceable) but he is too injury prone and Dice-K is done in Boston. CJ Wilson anyone?
9. Find a 3rd baseman after Youk is traded.
10. Find a closer if Paps is gone
I am sure there is more but this Napoleon Cognac is so good that I am having a hard time typing….
"Man that ball got outta here in a hurry, you know anything that travels that far oughta have a damn stewardess on it, don't you think?" - Crash Davis
I have to agree...
1. I thought Papi should have gone last year. We should have used the cash to keep Beltre. In retrospect, moving Youk would have worked as well.
2. Lackey HAS to go. WHether or not he WAS the ringleader of the clubhouse problems or not, Red Sox Nation sees him as a pariah. Whether we get something for him or not, send him packing.
3. Crawford should have a bounce-back year. Boston is often a tough place to get used to and, after this past season, Crawford will be looking to show improvement. He may not be worth the full value of his contract (J.D.Drew anyone?), but he should be a very serviceable LF.
4. Scutaro is FAR from the worst SS in the league and, unless you’re looking at a Hanley Ramirez or a Reyes, SS is NOT going to be your team’s offensive leader. Scutaro has done fine at SS and is far better thsan the revolving door we’ve had there since 2004.
5. Letting Paps walk is a no-brainer. We have Bard and Jenkes in the wings waiting to take over. Bard, as a closer, should be an adequate replacement. He only saw a downturn this past season because he was throwing too many innings. Bring him in for the 9th and let him throw the heat. Obviously, if Paps is available on the cheap, he’s worth keeping.
6. I’m not a fan of our current RF situation. I’m not so sure what the solution is, but someone on the FA market should be capable. Reddick serves as a serviceable fall-back option.
7. Afraid I must agree on Wake and Tek. They served admirably for the Sox, but it is time to let them retire with dignity. Salty and Lavarnway should prove to be a good team behind the plate, one resting out the other. Give Wake a coaching position with the team. If the pen falls apart, we can always resign him for the short term. Pitching him 2 innings between a few fire-ballers would prove interesting.
8. I like Bedard, too. Not an expensive option and, if he fails, not much $$ lost on him. I see Dice-K pitching decent. A good 4 or 5 spot. Its the last year of his contract and, if he wants someone to pay him following his contract, he’s going to have to perform. He’ll choke on his pride a bit and get with the program, just to increase his value. CJ Wilson would be a nice fit as well.
9. Finding a good short-term replacement for Youk (if the Sox move him) may not be a simple as it sounds. I truly believe that paying Beltre LAST off-season was the answer. How long before Middlebrooks is truly ready? Hindsight – always 20/20!
10. Use the money you would have paid Paps for some starting pitching. The pen wasn’t horrible. Move Bard to closer with Jenkes pushing him and pray it’s not the second coming of Gagne!
Maybe not the most insightful post, but not at all bad for my first.
by Rockhopper214 on Oct 23, 2011 11:56 AM EDT up reply actions
Couple interesting thoughts, and it was a good post.
One thing I don’t agree with is the notion that Dice-K will be a good 4/5 slot starter when he had TJ surgery in June and will likely not be back until (alot of estimates) are until late July or even August. I don’t think they should count on him making much of a contribution at all next year. Better to plan as if he won’t be there, and if he does come back and be an option when we inevitably lose starters than it’s a bonus.
I like Bedard but not as our #4 option going in, because I don’t think he can be counted on for more than 130 innings, which he hasn’t reached since 2007.
Obviously, your post was done before TJ surgery was confirmed for Lackey but he is not going anywhere. He is here to stay.
As far as Jenks, I will need to see if he has recovered before I consider him a lock down option for the 8th inning. Because of that I don’t think letting Paps is a no-brainer at all. People are correct when they say that relief pitching is more volatile, which is why letting a proven guy like him go in my opinion will worsen our bullpen situation considerably.
by The Name is Dalton on Oct 26, 2011 9:49 AM EDT up reply actions
I'm leary of the "Bard can be our closer" back-up plan.
Bard is a very talented pitcher. But he’s not Papelbon.
I’m a bit worried about Bard’s SwStr% dropping from 13.6% his rookie year to 9.7 & 11.0 the last two years. He’s not missing bats as dominantly as he did back then and nowhere near as well as Pap does. That wouldn’t be bad if Bard was getting a rise in O-Swing%, but that hasn’t changed much.
NBA Officiating - Corrupt? Incompetent? Which is worse? Does it matter? It sucks.
Still I'm not fond of throwing 10+ million dollar deals
on relief pitchers. I think its been proven time and time again that will come back to bite you
Oh, I agree and I hope my post didn't imply we should throw a 5 year 80M contract at Pap
I’m just saying that if we let Pap walk, I’m not convinced Bard is enough to fill that hole. And who replaces Bard?
NBA Officiating - Corrupt? Incompetent? Which is worse? Does it matter? It sucks.
If I may interject,
I think Bard is too valuable where he is, therefore he should stay. I have been saying that with the Theo negotiations going on, if we get a prospect or two as compensation, depending on what we get, you could use any combination of these two of these prospects Lowrie/Reddick/Kalish/Anderson to trade for a closer.
by aubatron2011 on Oct 14, 2011 4:44 PM EDT up reply actions
I agree in part, though i wonder what closers are available by trade
I’m almost positive Bailey won’t be available. More than likely I imagine that you are going to take a guy who is a set-up guy ala Bard and converting him to that role by trade route.
And while those guys certainly would bring in a closer, I still am wondering why we would use two of our most valuable prospect trade pieces on a closer position, but not be willing to pay 9-11 million a year for one. Those guys would have a much higher value in being in a trade for a starting pitcher. To me, I think it is a waste to spend them to get a closer.
by The Name is Dalton on Oct 26, 2011 9:56 AM EDT up reply actions
yeah agreed
if they aren’t willing to spend the money to keep Papelbon, my personal preference would be to sign a couple of guys like Broxton and Lidge who will almost certainly not be as good as they’ve been in the past, but might be somewhat salvageable and quite cheap. I think if they could manage to get those guys, between them, Jenks, and Bard, they could get a pretty good setup/closer combo there without too much money being involved.
That said, the more I think about it, the more I think that keeping Papelbon is probably the best choice- assuming he can be kept for not more than a 3 year deal at $12 million.
It's just a thought.
I just don’t see the ownership/FO going big this year in FA because the past performances of the players we have signed, esp in the pitching department. I thinnk the only spot that will truly addressed through FA is RF. I could see both Papi and Pap could be back but if they aren’t, then I think any big time pitcher(s) we acquire will be via trade.
by aubatron2011 on Oct 26, 2011 10:39 AM EDT up reply actions
Not saying it was a bad thought
But in my opinion a big problem with our relief pitching was that our starting pitching sucked in terms of going late in games. If they could use one or two of the prospects you mention to get a starting pitcher (preferably Lars and Reddick/Kalish) than it will help ease our bullpen issues. IF we could trade for a pitcher for the 4 slot, and even sign a cheap guy like Garland to eat innings out of the 5th or 6th slot then I think it would help. The only “expensive” starting pitcher I think they would go for is Oswalt who would be short term but probably around 8-10 million.
I agree they probably won’t go big in free agency. I think what happens with Papi will drive what happens with RF. If he leaves, they gain (probably) Lavarnway’s RH bat so they can afford to go with Reddick/Kalish and pick up a cheaper 4th OF. If Papi is back then they might go for a better RH RF’er and try to trade Reddick or Kalish for a SP.
by The Name is Dalton on Oct 26, 2011 10:47 AM EDT up reply actions
I agree with all of that,
Until the Papi and Pap, situations are dealt with, the rest of the moves can’t really fall into place. My thinking is Papi is more likely to be back than Pap. I have been saying that the compensation from what we get for Theo could play a role too in what type of trade the FO makes. If we get an outfielder similar to Reddick, who might be a year or two away, they could trade away Reddick, sign a RH RF’er to platoon with Kalish. Use Reddick to acquire a SP like you said, which should help the bullpen, esp. with Lackey being out.
by aubatron2011 on Oct 26, 2011 11:53 AM EDT up reply actions
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