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Comparing The 2003 Red Sox To The 2012 Cubs

The next time we see Theo Epstein smile, there will be a Cubs' logo behind him.

In November of 2002, a Red Sox baseball operations employee hailing from local Brookline got his first general manager job at the age of 28. He was the youngest to ever take the job -- not just in Boston, but anywhere in the majors -- and the pressure was on to end the supposed Curse of the Bambino, as it had been for everyone else who took the job prior to the newest GM, Theo Epstein.

Fast-forward to this week, and there is a similar situation brewing -- at least, in terms of a city without a championship in ages getting a new GM. Epstein, after two World Series titles in Boston, an average of 93 wins per year, five Wild Cards and an AL East division title, is moving on to the Chicago Cubs, who have not won a World Series since 1908, and haven't even appeared in one since 1945 -- a 66 year stretch. At least the Red Sox got there in 1946, 1967, 1975, and 1986, even if the results weren't in their favor.

Things have also become worse for Cubs' fans the past decade, as the Red Sox and cross-town White Sox, something like brothers in loser solidarity, both took home championships, leaving the Cubs standing alone with the likes of the San Francisco version of the Giants (your 2010 World Champions!) and the Cleveland Indians, two organizations who had or have waited for a far shorter time -- not to demean the decades-long pain of any Cleveland fans reading, because it's very real, but your last title came three years after the Cubs last World Series appearance, and you had three chances since. Think of how terrible it's been for you, then multiply that by Cubs.

That's the situation Theo is walking into, and he has at least five years to fix it, as his deal with the Cubs lasts that long and will pay him $20 million. The similarities between the 2003 Red Sox and the 2012 Cubs end at their shared failure, though, as Epstein is taking over a roster very different from the first one he inherited.

Star-divide

For one, the 2002 Red Sox won 93 games. They didn't make the playoffs, no, but that's because the Angels -- eventual World Series winners -- won 99 games and took the Wild Card. The 2011 Cubs went 71-91 and finished in fifth in the NL Central. This doesn't mean the Red Sox couldn't get any better, or that they had a set roster, but there was a core there to be built upon. 

The 2002 team featured Jason Varitek at catcher, free-agent acquisitions Johnny Damon in center and Manny Ramirez in left field, and homegrown players like Nomar Garciaparra at short and Trot Nixon in right. Not everything was perfect -- Rey Sanchez was the primary second baseman, Tony Clark spent more time at first base than anyone else, and Brian Daubach was a DH who could be improved upon -- but there was at least something to work with in the lineup. The rotation was in the same state: it needed some serious overhauling, as there were just four starters that stuck all year (with one of them being Frank Castillo, the Mark Portugal of 2002), but it did have The Best Pitcher Alive in Pedro Martinez, and Derek Lowe, who had been acquired in the same Dan Duquette trade that brought Varitek to the Red Sox.

The Cubs have just six players under contract heading into the off-season, for a grand total of nearly $73 million. That doesn't include arbitration-eligible contracts, or pre-arb players, of course, just the ones with a specific contract that is owed no matter what next season. Of the signed players, you have Alfonso Soriano (.244/.289/.469 in 2011, owed $19 million in 2012 and under contract through 2014), Carlos Zambrano ($19 million again, but mercifully in the final year of his contract), Ryan Dempster ($14 million, and had a much better season than his ERA suggests), Aramis Ramirez ($16 million, assuming his mutual option is picked up by both sides), Marlon Byrd ($6.5 million -- finally, a bargain!), shutdown reliever Sean Marshall ($3.1 million), and Carlos Marmol ($7 million for a closer with ridiculous strikeout stuff). There is a core there, but it's expensive, aging, and will likely not be part of Theo's first championship team in the city -- though a winning team is not out of the question, with the right winter moves.

Of your arb and pre-arb players, there is more to love. Matt Garza is in his third year of arb, and has a fourth year in 2013. He was the Cubs top starter in 2011, making a smooth transition to the NL where he set a career-high in strikeout rate. Geovany Soto has at least two years left as well, and while he hasn't reached the lofty heights he set upon entering the league once again, he's still one of the better catchers to have around. Randy Wells isn't anything special, but he's also cheap in his first year of arbitration. Tyler Colvin and Andrew Cashner haven't even reached arbitration yet, and neither has the jewel of the franchise, 21-year-old Starlin Castro, he of the .307/.341/.432 line in his second full-season in the bigs.

It's all something, but it's not a 93-win team that had room to improve upon. Of course, the same kind of moves that helped shore up that Boston team that had spent a significant portion of its budget could help the 2012 Cubs, who will be up against their budget soon, as well. Kevin Millar was purchased by the Red Sox from the Marlins to play first base in 2003, and played for $2 million. That's about all he was worth, but next to Clark's 556 OPS from 2002, Millar's 820 OPS looked positively Herculean. Boston sent Josh Thigpen and Tony Blanco to the Reds for Todd Walker to play second base, where he was basically average -- what he couldn't do defensively that Sanchez could, he did with his bat. Bill Mueller, a player Cubs fans know well, signed as a free agent for $2.1 million in 2003, and won the batting title in a park that seemed built for someone with his doubles power -- Mueller, who had never hit more than 29 doubles, hit 45 in 2003, and finished his career as a .321/.396/.522 hitter at Fenway.

The most significant low-cost pickup, of course, was David Ortiz, who had been cut by the Twins and didn't even become Boston's starting DH at the beginning of the year. In 128 games, Ortiz bashed 31 homers and 72 extra-base hits all along, and at a cost of $1.25 million.

This was a series of low-cost, high-reward pickups, and nearly all of them worked either as well as expected (by the front office, I mean -- not everyone was quite sure what to make of these guys when they got here), or far better. While baseball as a whole is better about recognizing the Bill Muellers of the world, these guys still exist, and can slip through the cracks of teams just like Ortiz did. Ask Jose Bautista and Nelson Cruz how that works.

It takes someone with an eye for this sort of player to make it work, and Epstein has that going for him. Some of his more recent transactions along the same lines haven't worked as well due to things like injuries -- Mike Cameron, whose deal looked like an absolute steal when signed, comes to mind -- but it's the process that matters. The Cubs could use the kind of process that has brought the Red Sox an inordinate amount of success over the last nine seasons, to the point where we can be crushed when the team "only" wins 179 games over its last two seasons. If the Cubs are lucky -- hey, they're due -- they won't have to wait much longer to see Theo take the next step from Hendry to a championship, just like Boston fans didn't have to wait long for Duquette's talented roster to do so.

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Excellent piece.

I agree. Theo has a decade of experience in building winners. He won’t have the same budget but he doesn’t need it as he won’t be going after the Lackeys and Lugos of yhe league of the league. I imagine he could compete pretty quickly with the rejuvenated, hungry and potentially well above average Connor Jacksons, Mike Aviles, Matt Albers, Scott Atchisons of the league. Who knows what he and his new manager (could it be Tito? That would be brilliant) can get out of their big contract players?!?!

by GerryT on Oct 13, 2011 12:18 PM EDT via mobile reply actions  

I'm doubting it's Tito

I’m guessing it’s Sandberg. After all, with Hendry gone, Sandberg may not have any more of a grudge with the Cubs and what could possibly be more exciting for Chicago fans than the Cubs getting not only the destroyer of Boston’s 86-year drought, but also a Cubs hero and hall of famer.

by wolf9309 on Oct 13, 2011 1:32 PM EDT up reply actions  

Edes mentioned

That Theo tried to get Sandberg for Pawtucket last season. So there’s a real good chance he might want him in Chicago.

by Marc Normandin on Oct 13, 2011 1:43 PM EDT up reply actions  

Are the Cubs suffering from fan-issues?

Do they need to sell more tix or increase the TV revenue?

If so, step 1: Hire Sandberg.

Step 2: Profit.

by cds7c on Oct 13, 2011 2:54 PM EDT up reply actions  

I think Ricketts wanted Sandberg last year

And Hendry either convinced him to go with Quade or Ricketts didn’t yet feel comfortable in his own baseball acumen to override Hendry. Not sure on the validity of that.

by The Name is Dalton on Oct 13, 2011 4:36 PM EDT up reply actions  

Well written

We are starving in Chicago. Praying that Theo can do for us what he did for you!

One day, the dream will come true.

by brianp88 on Oct 13, 2011 12:32 PM EDT reply actions  

Just for fun...

Eight current GMs were also GMs for the very same team when Theo took the reigns for the Red Sox: Cashman, Kenny Williams, Mark Shapiro, Billy Beane, Larry Beinfest, Doug Melvin, Bill Schmidt and Brian Sabean.

by AGuinness on Oct 13, 2011 6:25 PM EDT reply actions  

A Cubs fan's perspective

I’ve not been able to stop thinking about all this since the news became “official.” First, I’m sorry but your loss is our gain, and Theo really isn’t leaving the cupboard bare there. Your GM successor should be Cherrington, so he’s in house so you have continuity going for you and your core is still there and with a couple of tweeks this off-season should be just fine.

Like brianp88, I’m praying Theo can do for us what he did for you guys. However, I’m still a realist. I would love to think that Theo will want to make something of a splash in his first off-season and go after Pujols or Fielder, but I don’t see that happening. I think we suck for the next two years, especially if we stay with Quade as manager. After year two, we will be out from under our worst contracts. Our “prospects” such as they are should be MLB ready and in that time, Theo will have had two more drafts to continue to improve the system. I think he comes in and brings in some bright lieutenants (I’ve heard Josh Byrne’s name pop up) and solidifies the front office and player development before we really see major improvements on the field.

In response to cds7c—we did see a dip in ticket sales this year. Hiring Sandberg—more than just an outside chance now—would accomplish two things. It would be a major public relations hit and it would bring in a manager that’s “been there, done that” and been successful at every level he’s managed at.

"There is no tomorrow for you, and that makes you very dangerous people."--Jimmy McGinty (Gene Hackman) The Replacements

Time is an illusion--lunch time doubly so.

"The probability that we may fail in the struggle ought not to deter us from the support of a cause we believe to be just."--Abraham Lincoln

by snowyman28 on Oct 13, 2011 6:53 PM EDT reply actions  

Appreciate your point of view

I love it when fans of other teams that aren’t the Yankees or Rays are able to come in and see that the Red Sox do not, as you put it, have a bare cupboard. We’re in the midst of fan Chicken Little-ing, the likes of which I haven’t seen for a while.

I’m really happy for Cubs fans, because you guys really do deserve better. The money’s there, you’ve just had some epically stupid management. I think you should at least become serious contenders in a few years. I just hope your fanbase doesn’t jump to negative conclusions too quickly if the Cubs don’t improve much for 2012-13.

by Debageldond on Oct 13, 2011 7:13 PM EDT up reply actions  

I'm a little worried about that

The fan base right now, at least the ones that post and reply on message boards, are even more reactionary than usual. If the situation doesn’t change much in the next couple of years…and I don’t think it will significantly…there will be a huge outcry for Theo’s head and Ricketts to sell the team and all that. We used to have a little patience with the team, but ever since the 2003 epic meltdown, we’ve had a boat load of cliff jumpers. We should let them jump so the rest of us can enjoy the results when we do improve.

"There is no tomorrow for you, and that makes you very dangerous people."--Jimmy McGinty (Gene Hackman) The Replacements

Time is an illusion--lunch time doubly so.

"The probability that we may fail in the struggle ought not to deter us from the support of a cause we believe to be just."--Abraham Lincoln

by snowyman28 on Oct 14, 2011 1:47 PM EDT up reply actions  

nice post

I have to concur with pretty much all your points.

I wish for Theo the best of luck in Chicago – including breaking the curse there (unless, of course, it happens to be against the Red Sox! In that case, I hope for nothing but epic heartbreak for Cubbies).

NBA Officiating - Corrupt? Incompetent? Which is worse? Does it matter? It sucks.

by mmmmm on Oct 13, 2011 10:18 PM EDT up reply actions  

I don't see Quade staying

Even possibly being let go this year and bring Rhino in. Despite Hendry shunning him, it is obvious Sandberg cares about the organization considering he started his managing in A Ball when he probably easily could’ve leveraged into a AA position for another club. Ricketts wanted Sandberg over Quade and Hendry basically convinced him otherwise.

by The Name is Dalton on Oct 14, 2011 9:26 AM EDT up reply actions  

Nice Read

Marc, you might remember the Red Sox situation a bit better than I do, so I’m curious about something I’ve been pondering as a Cubs fan. What exactly was the state of the Red Sox system when he stepped in? To the best of my recollection (was in Boston then, but just don’t recall right now), it was a pedestrian system that had some promising young talent in the lower levels, but was overall a bit thin. That sounds fairly similar to the Cubs system at this juncture.

I was studying Theo’s first few moves once he took office, and honestly, the names that stuck out at me were coaches (He kept Buddy Bailey as the Red Sox AAA manager, and Bailey is in the Cubs system, and Ron Jackson was brought in as hitting coach). The more I’ve contemplated the Cubs current situation, a system that is thin at the top with few upper level impact pieces, but has a promising array of young talent in the lower levels, the more I feel that the best course of action for the Cubs is to roughly follow a similar course of action to what Theo did in his first few months with FA’s/trades, signing/trading for, as you note, guys like Millar, Mueller, Arroyo, Todd Walker and so forth (not sure the Cubs need to make a ton of picks in Rule 5, as Theo did early on).

While I’m not against a big splash signing like a Fielder/Pujols, I tend to think that, due to the Cubs current situation, and a market with enough teams that can spend, that we would have to significantly overpay to get someone to come (akin to the Orioles situation with top FA’s, for example). While guys like Kelly Johnson, Kevin Kouzmanoff, Jason Kubel, Josh Willingham aren’t exciting, signing those types of guys to build a deeper club may make more sense in his first year (particularly since there is, as of now, a good looking 2013 FA pitching class), and it may allow them to be more aggressive with the pitching market. Then, play this year out, bide time and let some of the bad contracts peter out (Zambrano/Soriano are the main culprits right now. Marlon Byrd may be a movable asset, perhaps more towards mid-season, although could see it happen in the winter).

As for other thoughts, personally, I’m hoping for DeMarlo Hale as the maanger. Granted, am curious what sort of role Hale had, or lack thereof, with the Red Sox clubhouse issues, but he’s always intrigued me as managerial material. My main hope is for a restructured player development strategy. I’m fine with Tim Wilken as the scouting director (could always do better, but he’s solid), but I’m not a big fan of Oneri Fleita’s work, as I tend to think he has odd patterns in regards to pushing guys, or not. The most important thing may be to establish system philosophies, particularly as it relates to hitting. The Cubs have long been an old-school, aggressive approach, going after “hit tool” guys without great focus on their batting approach. I love a good hit tool as much as the next guy, but that needs to be complemented with a good approach.

It should be a good match. Theo will get the love that he needs from Ricketts, as Ricketts has significantly increased the amateur signing budget internationally and with the draft. He won’t have Lucchino looking over his shoulder.

Anyhow, sorry to bore you guys with my Cubs thoughts. To be honest, if he decides to try and tear things down (which is certainly possible), I half wonder if Soto might be a trade candidate/target for you guys.

As for compensation, I’ll only be surprised if Brett Jackson is sent. I also don’t see any of the top picks from the last draft being sent, but I guess it can’t be ruled out. My hunch is upper level “pieces of the puzzle” guys (Welington Castillo as an upper level catcher, Ryan Flaherty as a versatile depth guy who can mash and perhaps stopgap at 3rd if Middlebrooks isn’t read, a Chris Carpenter or Alberto Cabrera as a power pen arm) or lower level, high upside talents.

by toonsterwu on Oct 14, 2011 2:22 AM EDT reply actions  

Looking back on the system at roughly that time.

I was a little surprised. Lester was drafted the year before Theo came in. Youkilis was down there, Shoppach, Hanley Ramirez, Freddy Sanchez, David Murphy, Anibal Sanchez, Jorge De la Rosa. The system had a ton of talent in it whether we knew it at the time or not.

I don’t think it’s going to be as easy now as it was then to build a team as Theo did going into 2003. Guys like Ortiz, Millar, Mueller, Nixon don’t really come along anymore. I’m really interested to see what he does there. The first thing may be to get Soriano out of town.

"We are not normal, We are Legends. People will tell their kids about us." - Deon Butler before Ohio State Game 2008.

by Rogue Nine on Oct 14, 2011 2:44 AM EDT up reply actions  

it's worth noting

because I’ve seen Duquette credited with this a lot- Lester was drafted under interim GM Mike Port while Theo was assistant GM (and Cherington was assistant director of player development)

by wolf9309 on Oct 14, 2011 9:40 AM EDT up reply actions  

The system was stronger at the lower levels, for sure

But the previous administration, as good as it was at finding players off of the scrap heap to contribute in both the lineup and rotation, never put together consistent waves of young talent. Things were kind of dead post-Nomar (although Carl Pavano was/is a solid development from the farm at the same time).

According to things Theo has said in the past, as well as former baseball ops people from Theo’s regime like Jed Hoyer, that kind of consistency from the farm is what really matters. That’s the kind of thing that helped them in 2007, when that team was almost completely retooled from the 2004 club. Cherington has the same focus on the farm, and Theo will bring that to Chicago with him.

by Marc Normandin on Oct 14, 2011 8:19 AM EDT up reply actions  

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