Adalberto Ibarra signs with Red Sox
by wolf9309 on Apr 26, 2010 9:46 AM EDT
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PrintIn the latest of the recent rash of Cuban ballplayers signing with MLB teams, the Red Sox reportedly signed Cuban catcher Adalberto Ibarra to a 5 year, $4.3 million Major League contract today (EDIT: Michael Silverman of the Herald is reporting that it's a $3 million contract with incentives that can bring it up to $4.3 million).
I don't know a ton about him, but here's what I could find- he primarily is a catcher, but has played C-1B-2B-3B. Can't find much about his defense at catcher at the moment, but I do know that last year, he hit .363 in Cuba, and seems to be able to hit pretty decently to all fields. He's reportedly been adding power lately, and at the age of 23, will probably develop some more over the next years. I'm sure more information about him will be easy to find very soon.
So what does this mean for Wagner, Expo, and Fed? I think it's pretty clear what it means for Martinez...
EDIT: Apparently Alskor got wind of this before me and posted some cool links to in minor lines threads, so I'm gonna steal them and post them here:
http://www.cubanballplayers.com/?p=1091
http://cubanballplayers.blogspot.com/2010/01/adalberto-ibarra-at-bat-in-cuba.html
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I've rarely ever heard anyone suggesting that Wagner looks like a legitimate full time catcher
so for 2011, perhaps Ibarra as primary catcher with Wagner backing him up?
Presumably he’ll start playing in the minors this year. Probably the only reasonable way he could get up in 2010 is if Papi gets released and Victor becomes a DH. Or, I suppose, Beltre (though releasing Beltre would be outright stupid since he has a player option for 2011 and having Youk-Martinez corners would be pretty terrible looking compared to Beltre-Youk)
Well I’m far from an expert but from what I understand, 1B is one of the easier positions to defend and in an admittedly very small sample size of less than a full season’s work VMart has posted a just slightly negative UZR/150 of -3. At 3B in a sample size of about 1.5 seasons (still small) Youk has posted a well above average 8.8 UZR/150. But yeah, compared to Youk-Beltre it isn’t as good but still wouldn’t be bad. But it on the other side of that it is nearly impossible to quantify the benefit of having a catcher who can actually throw a runner out at second behind home plate. I think the mostly likely thing to happen is that we see Wagner this season at C at some point, Ortiz (if he can’t take the confidence boost of hitting his first HR in april and run with it) would get released and VMart would become the full time DH in his place. I don’t envision Beltre seeing the Ax this season.
"We are not normal, We are Legends. People will tell their kids about us." - Deon Butler before Ohio State Game 2008.
I don't feel like from what I've seen of Youk at third, he can move quite as well there as he could in the earlier years, when he was playing there full-time
though I may be mistaken, or it could have been preparation because he wasn’t expecting to play 3rd (though he’d still have that this year)
Could also be I’m predisposed to think that, as the (admittedly tiny) SSS last year disagrees with me.
And Martinez, from what I've seen is considered about an average fielding first-baseman
so yeah, I’m not saying that Youk-Martinez corners would be bad so much as I’m saying that Beltre-Youk corners are defensively incredible.
Its all about the trade off
But like I said, hard to quantify the difference betwen VMart/Tek vs. Wagner/Ibarra which could make it worth it. But I think Ortiz would likely be the casualty, not Beltre.
"We are not normal, We are Legends. People will tell their kids about us." - Deon Butler before Ohio State Game 2008.
+1
If Ortiz can’t hit, he’s pretty much worthless as a baseball player. Beltre – at worst – is a great defensive sub at 3B. Beltre’s also cheaper.
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by nuthinboutnuthin on Apr 26, 2010 12:29 PM EDT up reply actions
Thanks for the links. H/T to Alskor.
Since he likes to go to the opposite field, it’s a good bet he’ll use the Monster to his advantage. Also, playing four infield positions could get him playing time as a ulility type at C,1st, 2nd, and 3rd before he settles into catching full time. Quite an interesting signing.
" Play Ball "
lefty with power to all fields
really, nothing not to love. It’ll be interesting to see where he gets placed and how he develops.
AA makes the most sense comfort-wise, with Iglesias there, but I can’t imagine they want him or Expo to be fully splitting time at catcher. Maybe a more significant move which involves Wagner going to Boston and him going to AAA- or just dropping Dusty or something of the sort. Probably has the most room for him in Salem, but I feel like he sounds too well developed.
Of course then, who knows about much of the information about any of these Cuban prospects before they come over, maybe he does need that much work. It’ll be interesting to see. I hope he’s closer to MLB-ready.
Remember, Expo is bilingual and has been teaching Iglesias English as well.
Some great value watching games in Portland this year.
" Play Ball "
oh yeah, expo's one of the reasons it culturally makes sense
it’s just does it make sense to be basically splitting time at catcher?
I suppose they could switch off catching and DH, but they may want both of them catching as many games as possible, since both (hopefully) project as big league catchers
I suppose the theory is that if you draft enough catchers
One of them is bound to be the next Carlton Fisk. (What? You wanted Johnny Bench? Be grateful you don’t wind up with Ray Fosse.)
by Mister Snitch on Apr 26, 2010 12:44 PM EDT up reply actions
and I absolutely love the theory
as long as they all get the right amount of playing time. Good catchers are hard to find and verrrry valuable.
They should be able to get Ibarra at bats in the line up in Portland.
Federowicz and Lavarnway are both getting a fair share of playing time in Salem.
Do you think maybe the FO looks at Ibarra as a Brandon Inge type player and they also plan to give him some playing time in the infield as well?
" Play Ball "
I'd be pretty happy with Ray Fosse right now
He was one of the top 100 catchers of all time, fwiw.
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Yes, Fosse was a great catcher
It’s just that he wound up having a very short career, is all I meant.
by Mister Snitch on Apr 26, 2010 1:47 PM EDT up reply actions
Let me correct that
I went and looked it up. Fosse played in the bigs for 12 years – not such a short career! But injuries kept him from having full, productive seasons during his stay in the bigs. He only played in more than 90 games for 4 of his seasons in the bigs. His batting average was consistent with a player struggling with injuries – he had a couple of .300 years, but had some sub-.200 years as well.
When he was right, he was awesome. Too bad he wasn’t ‘right’ more often.
by Mister Snitch on Apr 26, 2010 2:02 PM EDT up reply actions
No problem. Thanks for the credit.
I was going to make a FanPost, but then I thought: “Is the average fan going to be interested…?” I wasn’t sure it was that newsworthy or would stimulate that much discussion. Looks like I was wrong!
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A 6 million dollar IFA signing (1.5mm bonus) is pretty big.
Especially since he’s a catcher with an ML-ready bat.
USG
by Ben Buchanan on Apr 26, 2010 2:47 PM EDT up reply actions
actually, slightly different terms from Michael Silverman
He reported that it’s a $3 million with incentives that can get it up to $4.3 million.
My understanding of the wording is that the $1.5 million bonus is part of that amount- but I haven’t seen that mentioned anywhere besides the cuban ballplayers site. Pretty sure that’s the case though.
Fantastic
Sox spend forever trying to find a high-likelihood “catcher of the future” (no offense to Expo and Wagner) who is nearly or MLB ready. Can’t find him in trades, or the draft, so they go to the international market.
Good power hitting catcher, seems to have agility given his ability to play 3B and 2B despite his seemingly stocky build, can throw out runners, and has VERY little wear-and-tear on the knees. If he could speak English already, he’d be perfect.
USG
Could Dusty Brown be the PTBNL in the Van Every trade?
Would make room on the 40 man and he seems like the odd man out. If not Brown, Fabio Castro may have to be the one put on waivers.
" Play Ball "
Yeah, Brown makes sense.
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by bestbostonsports on Apr 26, 2010 12:04 PM EDT up reply actions
Interesting. I wonder if it has to do with the RedSox recent catching issues.
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by bestbostonsports on Apr 26, 2010 12:04 PM EDT reply actions
.363 sounds great
until you hear that was just 9th best in the league.
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Heh
That’s what they mean by ‘due diligence’.
by Mister Snitch on Apr 26, 2010 12:44 PM EDT up reply actions
Maybe major league ready?
I think he could catch at the current level no problem, and if his hitting line holds up even only slightly or hell let’s say he only hits .269, I would not have a problem with him in the majors. V-Mart is god-awful throwing out runners, it’s about time we got someone who could throw out a runner.
.269 would be impressive
switching from the much-lower-caliber Cuban League to MLB, while playing in a whole new climate and environment. Plus, I don’t know for sure, but most of the Cubans don’t speak English when they come over. So I think he’s hopefully a catcher-of-the-near-future-but-not-now.
Then again, really, there is so little information available that it’s hard to even speculate. We’ll see what the Sox do with him.
Micheal Silverman has Ibarra reporting to Ft Myers first to get in shape.
Boston Herald:
More details on C Ibarro deal
More on the Adalberto Ibarro deal…
The deal still has a few procedural matters to be completed before it can be considered official but the major-league deal is worth $3 million over five years, with incentives that could bring the total worth to $4.3 million. He will report first to the club’s minor-league complex in Fort Myers in order to get in game-ready shape, then the club will decide which minor-league team he will report to. The club is quite high on his offensive potential and his throwing arm but because he has not focused on catching until the last couple of years — he played first, second and third — his defense still needs development.
How long that development will take is what everyone, including the Red Sox, is quite curious to find out.
" Play Ball "
So where's this guy going to start at?
AA? AAA?
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no word yet
and no one except scouts really know him well enough to judge. I’d be surprised if he started at AAA. The more I think about it, the more I think Portland makes sense.
Splitting duties with Expo would be troublesome, though.
USG
by Ben Buchanan on Apr 26, 2010 4:54 PM EDT up reply actions
Yeah, dont sit Expo.
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by bestbostonsports on Apr 26, 2010 5:02 PM EDT up reply actions
yeah i agree
but not sure where else he fits. If he’s well-enough developed, they could maybe set him at AAA and get rid of Dusty. I don’t really see an opening for a full-time catcher until maybe we get down to Greenville. Expo certainly doesn’t seem ready for AAA to me. I’m thinking split the two of them between catcher and DH. But again, don’t know what his development is like. Putting him on the same team as Iglesias and Expo makes a lot of sense to me for the transition.
Id guess AA...
Put him with his former Cuban teammate Iglesias…
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This signing is interesting.
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by bestbostonsports on Apr 26, 2010 5:02 PM EDT reply actions
Now rosenthal mentions kurt suzuki
What would red sox give up for 3 years of control of suzuki?
Rosenthal On Kurt Suzuki, Heath Bell, Dusty Baker
By Tim Dierkes [April 26 at 2:41pm CST]
A look at the latest from Ken Rosenthal of FOX Sports…
Rosenthal explains why we shouldn’t expect the A’s to make catcher Kurt Suzuki available in trade. He suggests that if Suzuki did become available, the demand to acquire three-plus years of his services would exceed Cleveland’s return last summer for Victor Martinez. Suzuki hasn’t had extension talks with the A’s, though John Shea of the San Francisco Chronicle tweeted that he’s open to the idea.
http://msn.foxsports.com/mlb/story/nats-looking-out-for-strasburg-or-themselves
Bell, as a closer, will be overpriced, I'm sure.
USG
by Ben Buchanan on Apr 26, 2010 7:13 PM EDT up reply actions
Then again...draft picks if we let him walk
(Which he’ll inevitably demand, since he probably wants to be the closer)
USG
by Ben Buchanan on Apr 26, 2010 7:13 PM EDT up reply actions
Wagner was good because he cost us nothing in prospects and got us draft picks.
Bell is cheap this year and under control another year. He would not be cheap in prospects or money.
Suzuki is prohibitively expensive, as he says.
There’s just no way that happens… arm, a leg and another leg.
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Suzuki isn't going anywhere
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by Frederick0220 on Apr 26, 2010 10:32 PM EDT up reply actions
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