Building The Red Sox Lineup: Of Course Dustin Pedroia Is Second
by Ben Buchanan on Dec 31, 2010 6:01 AM EST
in Fun Stuff
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PrintIt seems that Dustin Pedroia is firmly ensconced as the Red Sox' #2 hitter, as the former MVP second baseman doubled up Carl Crawford (who has his second straight second place finish).
No surprise here, really. With a lefty Ellsbury leading off, Pedroia is one of the best right-handed on-base guys on the team, and actually seems to perform slightly better against righties despite being one himself. His contact ability (4% swinging strikes last year was a career high) and patience should build up pitch counts early, and if nothing else, he'll likely move Ellsbury along should he get on ahead of him.
My pick (following my own lineup's leadoff of Crawford, mind) is again after the jump. Before you click through, though, make your pick for #3.
To repeat, some clarifications:
- I'll include both Scoot and Lowrie. After one has been chosen, the other will stop being an option. Ditto for Varitek and Salty.
- Darnell McDonald will also be included, while Ryan Kalish will not. Consider that my guess at the 25-man.
- Put it together the way you want it, not the way you think it will be.
1. Jacoby Ellsbury, L
2. Dustin Pedroia, R
(Worth noting: An issue with the poll system lead to the last piece's poll switching to "who should bat third" late last night. If you voted in that "new" poll, just vote again here. All results from there will be ignored.)
My Pick: Dustin Pedroia
I toyed with the idea of Jed Lowrie for a fair while, but really, the choice was always Dustin Pedroia.
The Red Sox really should kill righties next year. It's ridiculous how many players they have that kill them. I could easily see five players with an OPS of .900 or greater against them, even. The key, then, is to get all those players plenty of at bats against the righties without leaving the lineup completely exposed against lefty relievers.
Briefly, I thought about moving Kevin Youkilis to the #2 spot and sliding Ortiz in at #3, basically making it so that anyone who wanted to pitch to both Crawford and Ortiz with a lefty would have to risk leaving him out there against Youkilis, who hit .404/.513/.798 against southpaws. Yeah.
However, I decided that the end of the lineup's high-OBP, low SLG ways would likely lead to a fair few stranded runners, which left only Lowrie to challenge Pedroia. There, the question was settled by the same uncertainty that kept Lowrie out of the leadoff spot. As far as I'm concerned, Jed Lowrie will kill lefties next year. But against righties, I'm not quite as certain.
So it's Dustin Pedroia with his 3-year .315/.373/.488 line that gets the nod from me. He may not discourage the LOOGY like a Lowrie or Youkilis would, but they can be used elsewhere, and the reliever might well be lucky to get to his third batter with fewer than 15 pitches on his arm already.
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Comments
Youk
hate having Youk bat 5th which is the only other option as he’s arguably the best hitter in the lineup
Its a great problem to have
unless we hit gonzalez 3rd we are going to have to hit youk 5th.
I thought it was better to have your best hitters in the 1, 2, and 4 spots.
Which would mean we’d have pretty good to excellent hitters everywhere in the top 5 except for #1.
Fenway: "An alternate and better universe, disguised as a ballpark." --Thomas Boswell
IF the Sox
dont go:
2) Pedroia
3) Agon
4) Youk
the Sox are weakening a very powerful lineup.
Ellsbury should not leadoff, he distorts the entire lineup.
My thoughts exactly.
"We are not normal, We are Legends. People will tell their kids about us." - Deon Butler before Ohio State Game 2008.
I think it depends..
If Ells is hitting and gets his OBP up, I think he should be lead off. I wouldn’t have him leadoff at the beginning of the season unless he proved himself in spring training. I probably do a RLRL for 1-2-3-4 with Crawford as 2nd and Youk as 3rd.
One weak point in this line up is that there are way too many lefties. One LOOGYin the 7th can be a ultimate rally killer. It would be a horror film with Javy Lopez coming back from the dead.
Ells should be the table setter or 9th. If he is doing well, then switch the the top 4 to a LRLR with Gonzo as 3rd and Youk as clean up.
I would like to see how this line up deals with the Sabathias and mainly southpaw pitchers with breaking balls as their main weapons, they could cause a huge amount of havoc.
Pedroia should hit 3rd in every lineup
AGonz 4th
Youk 5th
!!!!! GONZO !!!!!
!!!!! CRAWFORD !!!!!
!!!!! LIVERPOOL !!!!!
I'm blissfully ignoring the lineup that's been voted on by general consensus.
Still working on my lineup.
I'm a 7 WAR player in bed.
Official Baker of Red Sox Nation
yeah me too
the whole series became kinda pointless for me personally after Ells won leadoff. Its really not smart to give the second worst hitter in the lineup the most at bats
))<>((
by German Red Sox Fan on Dec 31, 2010 5:05 PM EST up reply actions
Youk should bat second (high OBP)
And I still have a problem with Ellsbury leading off. We want high OBP guys to be at the top of the order.
So Lowire than?
I agree with Youk in the two hole…perhaps Gonz 3, Pedey 4?
Get rid of Coughlin. Get rid of Eli. Get rid of Reese. Win Super Bowls.
by tito (eight and oh) on Dec 31, 2010 12:12 PM EST up reply actions
This lineup is gonna end up bad!...Papi 6th?...really?...
If Lowrie is going to start at SS (like almost everybody wants…I prefer Scutaro)…we’ll have 5 lefty batters in a row…Ortiz 6th…followed in whichever order by Lowrie…Drew…and Salty…and then Ells when the lineup starts all over…that ain’t good!…even against a righty…
But, to his point, against RHP...
Both Lowrie and Salty will be batting LH, right?
So, for a line up against RHP, he’s got it correct that we’ll have 5 LHHs in a row.
Come to think of it...
We only have two RHH in the line up (Youk and Pedroia), if we vote Lowrie over Scutaro… 5 LHHs, and 2 Switch Hitters.
So I think it’s impossible to set up this line up in a way that against RHP, we won’t have 5 guys batting left-handed in a row. It’s only a real problem for when they throw a LHP in relief, and then we can break it up with the switch hitters.
It is the Southpaw pitchers that bother me..
Drew, Papi and Ells tend to swing on some of inside breaking balls by LHP… RHPs that I am not worried about, but I can see some average LHP having some big games against the Sox in 2011.
Not a big problem, actually
Because if you throw a lefty pitcher in, Lowrie turns into SuperJed! (since he gets to bat RH) and Salty—well Salty’s a downgrade, but you could also possibly replace him with Tek, if need be.
Fenway: "An alternate and better universe, disguised as a ballpark." --Thomas Boswell
Non-registered SBNation members shouldn't be allowed to vote
v RHP
Crawford
Pedroia
Gonzo
Youk
Ortiz
Lowrie
Drew
Salty
Ellsbury
v LHP
Lowrie
Pedroia
Youk
Gonzo
Cameron
Crawford
McDonald
Ellsbury
Varitek
by OzTiger on Dec 31, 2010 9:42 AM EST via mobile reply actions
I don't think you can stop them from voting.
Fenway: "An alternate and better universe, disguised as a ballpark." --Thomas Boswell
I know...
I just can’t believe Ellsbury would still be the overwhelming choice to bat leadoff. If you read the comments, there are only about two or three Jacoby-to-leadoff supporters, dwarfed by either Crawford or Lowrie.
by OzTiger on Dec 31, 2010 4:14 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
maybe my view is skewed
I think it’s actually kind of cool in the sense that it means several thousand different people are reading what everyone here has to say every day.
Especially because this is more of a community/discussion forum than most Sox blogs I see around the internet, so everyone can really contribute their thoughts. Maybe someone comes and votes (because the poll is there) and then changes their mind based on the discussion that happens.
I doubt most of those people are reading the discussion though.
I see it more as “Derp, Ellsbary are fast, herp derp.”
I'm a 7 WAR player in bed.
Official Baker of Red Sox Nation
by TheLoneDavid on Dec 31, 2010 7:00 PM EST up reply actions
By the way, your LHP isn't really plausible.
I don’t think the Sox keep five outfielders on the roster next year. So one of Drew or Ortiz probably needs to be in the lineup.
Fenway: "An alternate and better universe, disguised as a ballpark." --Thomas Boswell
On second thought, make that one of Drew, Ortiz, or Scutaro.
In principle you could put Scutaro at SS, Lowrie at 3B, and move Youk to DH.
Fenway: "An alternate and better universe, disguised as a ballpark." --Thomas Boswell
I agree, 5 outfielders isnt very likely.
Especially when you see that the Sox need VTek and Scutaro/Lowrie on the bench.
"I don't put any foreign substances on the baseball. Everything I use is from the good old U.S.A."
JVSM
Pedroya Lova
by Dustin's #1 Fan on Dec 31, 2010 10:12 AM EST up reply actions
Why would that make a difference?
Ortiz
Tek
Salty
Youk
Gonzo
Pedroia
Scutaro
Lowrie
Crawford
Ellsbury
Drew
Cameron
McDonald
Lester
Buchholz
Lackey
Beckett
Daisuke
Papelbon
Bard
Jenks
Wheeler
Atchison
Wakefield
LHP
Lowrie plays all four infield positions, McDonald and Cameron both hit LHP. It’s a perfect fit.
Over the Monster -- SB Nation's Resident Red Sox Site
USG
by Ben Buchanan on Dec 31, 2010 11:08 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
that, sir
is a damn fine roster.
At least 2 people who can play every position, and shortstop and catcher are the only positions that don’t have three.
Lowrie can catch
Lowrie can do ANYTHING.
I'm a 7 WAR player in bed.
Official Baker of Red Sox Nation
by TheLoneDavid on Dec 31, 2010 3:04 PM EST up reply actions
+1
"I don't put any foreign substances on the baseball. Everything I use is from the good old U.S.A."
JVSM
Pedroya Lova
by Dustin's #1 Fan on Dec 31, 2010 11:31 AM EST up reply actions
There's nothing wrong with your lineup
I actually like it.. But it just runs contrary to recent history. Under Tito, at least, the Sox’s 25-man roster typically consists of 4 OF, 6 IF, DH, 2 C, 5 SP, and 7 RP.
If the entire infield is ready to go at the beginning of the season, then there’s good reason to go 5:5. But if Scutaro or Gonzo (for instance) is still not ready at the beginning of the season, then it’s harder to make that case.
Fenway: "An alternate and better universe, disguised as a ballpark." --Thomas Boswell
I think it's plausible, just because of the versatility of guys like Scoot and Lowrie
but yeah, if someone doesn’t look healthy, chances may be against it.
This does seem like a year that they would want a lot of depth in the outfield though, with Ellsbury and Cameron being a degree of health question marks and Drew being a year older.
Utility...
You also have to think Theo will at least look for a cheap option that mirrors a player like Bill Hall – Someone who literally can play every position (save for pitcher/catcher). Does that person currently exist? Not sure, but Hall helped out quite a bit last year with his extreme versatility. If they carry 4 OF, McDonald is odd man out in my opinion due to Cameron’s contract. Unless they trade him (Cam), you really can’t justify not giving the time to Cameron. Plus, if he’s healthy, Cameron is a mighty fine defensive player with some pop. I do agree OF health is an issue with 2 ancient outfielders and a previously busted Jacoby, but also remember guys like Kalish, Reddick, and Nava were pretty darn serviceable as injury replacements. If I were the front office I’d see what was out there for utility men who are true IF/OF players.
by millertime05201 on Dec 31, 2010 1:42 PM EST up reply actions
The number of Lowrie-Zobrist-Scutaro type players available is small.
Frequently, the more positions a player covers, the worse he is at all of them. (Again, see Hall, Bill and Patterson, Eric.)
Fenway: "An alternate and better universe, disguised as a ballpark." --Thomas Boswell
I picked for Crawford, but I am having second thoughts
If we bat Adrian Gonzalez clean up he would ‘protect’ whoever was hitting 3rd. Sort of what Manny did to Ortiz. No one wanted to walk Ortiz to face Manny with bases loaded, therefore they through a bunch of fastballs.
Runs above average against FB in last 3 years AVG
Ortiz: 10.86 (inconsistent stats)
Drew: 16.03 (sudden decline last year from 20 to 3)
Youk: 31.83 (really good amount of tuns against FB)
Crawford: 4.96 (terrible numbers, even went below average in ’08)
Lowrie: -4.96 (negative numbers in ’08 and ’09, did get a solid 5 last year)
As you can see, Youk is our best FB hitter and could benefit from hitting in front of AGon like Ortiz benefited from hitting in from of Manny.
Ellsbury
Crawford
Youkilis
Gonzalez
Ortiz
Pedroia
Drew
Lowrie
Salty
Ta-Dah! its
L L R L L R L S S
not bad, not bad at all
"I don't put any foreign substances on the baseball. Everything I use is from the good old U.S.A."
JVSM
Pedroya Lova
by Dustin's #1 Fan on Dec 31, 2010 10:09 AM EST reply actions
And if you are wondering
Ortiz’s Runs above average 2003-2007
2003: 26.9
2004: 27.0
2005: 43.5
2006: 47.3
2007: 37.8
"I don't put any foreign substances on the baseball. Everything I use is from the good old U.S.A."
JVSM
Pedroya Lova
by Dustin's #1 Fan on Dec 31, 2010 10:39 AM EST up reply actions
I just dont understand how people can
put Crawford 3rd?
Adrian Gonzales and Youk are the Red Sox best hitters/power on the team. They must go 3rd and 4th in the lineup.
The mistake was putting Ellsbury in the leadoff spot.
There is no way Tito moves both of his two best hitters out of the top 3.
This would be the equivalent of moving Pujols down to the 5th slot to make room for Lance Berkman who likes to hit 3rd.
my point exactly explained above this very comment
"I don't put any foreign substances on the baseball. Everything I use is from the good old U.S.A."
JVSM
Pedroya Lova
by Dustin's #1 Fan on Dec 31, 2010 10:10 AM EST up reply actions
yeah once Ellsbury was first, it all will be wrong
he’s just not the best choice for leadoff hitter.
Whatever, I think we have a good problem here, which is that the team has so many good hitters that we want them all near the top of the order.
Well, to be fair
Both Gonzalez and Crawford hit righties better than Youk in 2010.
Over the Monster -- SB Nation's Resident Red Sox Site
USG
by Ben Buchanan on Dec 31, 2010 11:10 AM EST up reply actions
If there's any truth to Tito and the players wanting lineup consistency
then Ells has to be first. Though SoxAcumen is right; it’s hugely problematic. As you all know, Crawford against lefties has some tough numbers. In that case however, I also don’t see him hitting 3rd nor do I see a $20m player hitting 5th or 6th. I think Crawford has to lead off against righties and Ells against lefties, and Pedey, Gonz, Youk, 2-4 in any lineup.
So even though Ells is the people’s choice, this is what I would like to see:
So RHP:
Crawford
Pedey
Gonz
Youk
Ortiz
Lowrie/Scoots
Drew
Salty
Ells
LHP:
Ells
Pedey
Gonz
Youk
Cameron (for Drew)
Crawford
Lowrie (maybe swap him w/ Cam, depending on whether he delivers like OTM thinks he will)
Darnell (for Ortiz)
Tek
(or if you want to get really crazy, put Lowrie at 3B, Scoots at SS, Youk at DH and run Darnell and Cam in the OF, but I do not see that happening)
Yes what jk77 said
Pedroia, Gonz and Youk always in the 2,3,4 slots makes the most sense. After that you can fiddle with the lineups, but those three are concrete.
imgaine though
Pedroia battling off 10-15 pitched before they even get to the #2 hitter. fun to think about. I feel like we’re gonna be facing a lot of long/middle relief this season.
by millertime05201 on Dec 31, 2010 1:52 PM EST up reply actions
I like the consistency agreement....
….and Crawford has stated he’d probably rather hit 2 or 3. Gonzalez also made the comment that they should probably bat him 4th. So, if Jacoby gets slotted in a spot other than #1 and they pay attention to their $300 million men:
RHP:
Pedy
Crawford
Youk
Gonzalez
Ortiz
Lowrie/Scoots
Drew
Salty
Ells
LHP:
Ellsbury
Pedy
Crawford
Gonzo
Youk
Ortiz
Cameron (for Drew)
Lowrie
Tek
by millertime05201 on Dec 31, 2010 1:50 PM EST up reply actions
Im not against these lineups... I dont think they are the best possible
but Pedroia could be an excellent lead off guy.
Pedroia disagrees with you on that assessment.
Fenway: "An alternate and better universe, disguised as a ballpark." --Thomas Boswell
Nope.
The $300 million men are paid enough to hit where they’re told. Obviously if they struggle hitting in certain slots, Tito will retool, but until then, I want to see Crawford and Ells at top and bottom of the order respectively, and Gonz at #3 (whether or not the stats people say best hitter should be #4). Though I am intrigued by a comment above positing Ortiz as the ideal #3 ahead of Gonzalez—who doesn’t have vicious righty-lefty splits—putting Youk at #5 and then, I guess Drew, Lowrie/Scoots, Salty, Ells.
I think Dustin's #1 Fan was making the argument
… for Youkilis as the #3, and following the pattern of success Big Papi had hitting ahead of Manny from 2003-2007.
I’m not sure the argument was to put the 2011 Big Papi in at #3, but rather that Youkilis’ success against FBs makes him the most ideal candidate to hit in front of Gonzalez.
I’d buy that argument, except that I set Pedroia in the 2-hole, and I cannot see how we bat our two RHHs back to back in this line up. We’d get eaten alive when they went to lefties out of the bullpen.
crawford can hit 3rd
crawford pounds extra base hits doubles triples and his homers are climbing into the 20,s soon. crawfords slugging percantage was higher than texieras last season.
cus teix sucked last season
"I don't put any foreign substances on the baseball. Everything I use is from the good old U.S.A."
JVSM
Pedroya Lova
by Dustin's #1 Fan on Dec 31, 2010 10:43 AM EST up reply actions
crawford still had a ton of
extra base hits i am not saying crawford is the best 3 hitter all i am saying is he is good enough to hit 3rd.
by brady12mvp3 on Dec 31, 2010 10:46 AM EST up reply actions
I choose Ortiz
Crawford 2010 vs. RHP: .329/.375/.546
Ortiz 2010 vs. RHP: .297/.416/.643
Gonzalez 2010 vs. RHP was .278/.377/.510, but the previous season gives us the ceiling of what he could do at Petco vs. RHP: .305/.448/.629—and even that is expected to rise at Fenway.
That said, I’ll take Ortiz/Gonz/Youk as my 3-4-5 vs. RHP. I think of anybody in the lineup Ortiz has the most to gain by batting ahead of what should be the Red Sox’ most feared slugger in Gonzalez, so this should optimize his performance. I’m not afraid of vulnerability to LOOGies in this combination because with five lefties in the lineup, there has to be one lefty-lefty pair somewhere, and I choose to do it with Gonzalez who has the best splits against LHP.
For those who want Youkilis 3rd against RHP (or even 4th):
Youk 2010 vs. RHP: .275/.376/.487
but in fairness compare his last full season and career high:
Youk 2009 vs. RHP: .304/.404/.560
What's up with Gonzalez's splits last year?
Can anyone fill me in? Did he change his swing? His numbers vs. LHP spiked and his numbers vs. RHP dipped, pretty noticeably in both cases.
it looks like an anomaly to me
I’d be very surprised if he continued that success against left handed pitchers.
I think the dip was due to shoulder injury, but the spike against lefties looks unsustainable- though you won’t see me complaining if he can continue an over 25% LD rate against lefties…
I'm not entirely convinced.
Will he have a wOBA over .400 against them again? Not likely.
But his walk rate was sustained from last year. His strikeout rate dropped noticeably. And you have to consider that last year’s .339 mark was actually deflated both by a .265 BABIP and Petco. I wouldn’t be surprised to see Gonzo manage a .360-or-better mark against southpaws in 2011.
Over the Monster -- SB Nation's Resident Red Sox Site
USG
by Ben Buchanan on Dec 31, 2010 11:18 AM EST up reply actions
Is it bad that I just realized there is a special section called "fun stuff"?
embrace the martian
Twitter: @BoldandBrash
I agree on him batting third
and than Gonzalez, and Youk, and Ortiz.
by Marisa Ingemi on Dec 31, 2010 12:22 PM EST up reply actions
I think having Youk fifth makes the lineup deeper
Gonzalez is a perfect #4 hitter at Fenway park.
by Marisa Ingemi on Dec 31, 2010 12:39 PM EST up reply actions
why ?
why take the best hitter and probably the highest paid player on your team and move him to 5th?
Adrian Gonzales could be the best hitter in the AL, he could win the AL MVP and this guy bats 5th in your lineup?
Well I see that the Yankees are not crazy enough to move Teixeira to the 5th slot.
In the poll I voted Youk and only took into consideration who would hit 3rd and 4th.
I like Youk’s ability to get on base in front of Gonzalez, and I like Gonzalez 4th because someone out of our top 3 will most likely get on in front of him. However, hitting Gonzalez 3rd could give him more AB, and he looks like he’s our best hitter.
embrace the martian
Twitter: @BoldandBrash
by BoldandBrash on Dec 31, 2010 11:26 AM EST reply actions 1 recs
Couldn't Have Said It Better Myself.
"Common sense is quite rare." - Voltaire
The Artist Formerly Known as PacoL250
Resident Psychologist and Tech Support at Over the Monster: SB Nation's Resident Red Sox Web Site
HAPPY NEW YEAR OTM !
hope you all have a safe and happy new year !………………come on truck day !!!!
by RED SOX are #1 in my heart on Dec 31, 2010 11:38 AM EST reply actions
Ells and Pedroia? You must be kidding.
And Crawford leads the voting for #3? Really?? You people want Crawford taking more PAs than Gonzo or Youk?
Gonzo is clearly the best #3 guy – Big power with protection behind him.
lol
"I don't put any foreign substances on the baseball. Everything I use is from the good old U.S.A."
JVSM
Pedroya Lova
by Dustin's #1 Fan on Dec 31, 2010 12:30 PM EST up reply actions
wRC+ vs. R past 2 seasons
Crawford (153, 135)
Pedroia (143, 123)
Youkilis (135, 152)
Gonzalez (137, 185)
Ortiz (177, 115)
I would flip Youk and Gonz.
or Youk and Ortiz per Dustin’s#1fan (intriguing idea to see what Ortiz does with some serious protection behind him in Gonzalez. Might be a good way to get the best out of all your hitters. Though I do not like having Ortiz’ and Gonzalez’ serious lack of speed together. So many double plays waiting to happen. Youk has some hustle.
I think some people here may be misevaluating Crawford.
I, for one, don’t see him as Ells with more power, I see him as Pedroia with less on-base ability, but more speed. As such, I’d put him either second or fifth, with his diminutive counterpart taking the other slot, as in the below example:
Lowrie
Crawford
Youkilis
Gonzalez
Pedroia
Ortiz
Saltalamaccia
Drew
Ellsbury
I remain unconvinced that Ellsbury should be starting though, my preferred lineup is:
Lowrie
Pedroia
Gonzalez
Youkilis
Crawford
Cameron
Ortiz
Drew
Saltalamaccia
Ortiz gets pushed down in the lineup for at least April, possibly switching with Cameron depending on who the hot hand is that day.
I'm a 7 WAR player in bed.
Official Baker of Red Sox Nation
Ortiz
I think it should be Crawford, not Pedey 2nd, but either way, if Ortiz hits 3rd with some combination of AGon, Youk, Crawford, or Ped behind him, Papi will get a healthy serving of meatballs to terrorize as he sees fit.
by The Burning Scheyer Jersey on Dec 31, 2010 3:23 PM EST reply actions
How many angels can dance on the head of a pin?
I am loving this debate: The bottom line is that this team will hit. I think this is a good problem to have. And, although enjoyable I liken this to a debate of theologians (all experts of course with various opinions and interpretations) as they ponder how many angels can dance on the head of a pin…the bottom line is we know they can dance – just like we know this team can hit
"Man that ball got outta here in a hurry, you know anything that travels that far oughta have a damn stewardess on it, don't you think?" - Crash Davis
The Starters need to pitch no doubt but....
with the added pop in this lineup late innings look good and the bullpen (on paper) seems to be upgraded I think the Sox need one more leftie…so, I hope close ones tilt in the Sox favor. Also, NYY will also have question marks too with their Starters
"Man that ball got outta here in a hurry, you know anything that travels that far oughta have a damn stewardess on it, don't you think?" - Crash Davis
guys, this the lineup
RHP
R/L Pos Player
L CF Jacoby Ellsbury
L LF Carl Crawford
R 3B Kevin Youkilis
L 1B Adrian Gonzalez
L DH David Ortiz
R 2B Dustin Pedroia
L RF J.D. Drew
S SS Jed Lowrie
S C Jarrod Saltalamacchia
S C Jason Varitek
R SS Marco Scutaro
R OF Mike Cameron
R OF Darnell McDonald
LHP
R/L Pos
L CF Jacoby Ellsbury
R 2B Dustin Pedroia
L LF Carl Crawford
L 1B Adrian Gonzalez
R 3B Kevin Youkilis
L DH David Ortiz
S SS Jed Lowrie
R RF Mike Cameron
S C Jarrod Saltalamacchia
S C Jason Varitek
R SS Marco Scutaro
L RF J.D. Drew
R OF Darnell McDonald
"I don't put any foreign substances on the baseball. Everything I use is from the good old U.S.A."
JVSM
Pedroya Lova
by Dustin's #1 Fan on Dec 31, 2010 4:48 PM EST reply actions
I'm surprised at your audacity, posting this here.
Especially considering the number of people who don’t want Ellsbury leading off, and the slightly smaller contingent of people who don’t even want him starting.
I'm a 7 WAR player in bed.
Official Baker of Red Sox Nation
by TheLoneDavid on Dec 31, 2010 7:02 PM EST up reply actions
Well, Terry said Ells was his lead off man? Who makes the calls, the OTM comments section or the Boston Red Sox Manager?
Plus, Ellsbury’s carrer OBP is greater than Crawford’s.
.344 > .337
"I don't put any foreign substances on the baseball. Everything I use is from the good old U.S.A."
JVSM
Pedroya Lova
by Dustin's #1 Fan on Jan 1, 2011 12:51 AM EST up reply actions
There is only room for improvement for a young hitter like him
"I don't put any foreign substances on the baseball. Everything I use is from the good old U.S.A."
JVSM
Pedroya Lova
by Dustin's #1 Fan on Jan 1, 2011 12:48 PM EST up reply actions
Youk for #3
Done. No question. Just think about the days of Papi and Manny, eh?
With Youk at 3 and Gonzo at 4, Tito would have a younger version of that to a a degree. And they’d be both Gold Glovers to boot!
I don’t get this fascination with Crawford winning every poll; either the poll system is borked or people are being stupid. Bottom line: Crawford doesn’t have enough power to hit 3-4; he’s either 5 or 6.
"Common sense is quite rare." - Voltaire
The Artist Formerly Known as PacoL250
Resident Psychologist and Tech Support at Over the Monster: SB Nation's Resident Red Sox Web Site
The entire argument says two things
1) Even though Boston fans love Youk I still think Youk is underrated as many can justify him in multiple positions within the batting order. This guy can be the number 2, 3, 4, 5, 6 or 7 spot. In fact, if he did not provide such power he could be justified as the leadoff guy because of his OBP. The guy does everything except steal bases so he can be moved around. Crazy because the same can be said for his defense.
2) Ells is a touch overrated. He is fast and has a high potential ceiling, but he is a number nine hitter and should not get a sniff at the top end of the order, especially on a playoff roster. Like many I now wonder if the guy is willing to play when dinged up. I think he may become an increasing headache to this team.
Try everyone at the leadoff spot except for Papi, Cameron and Ells.
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