Do the Red Sox Need Aroldis Chapman?
Josh Beckett. Jon Lester. John Lackey. Daisuke Matsuzaka. Clay Buchholz. Each of these players, on any other team except the Yankees would be at or near the top of the rotation. Lester, Lackey and Dice-K are signed through at least 2012. Depending on this season, Beckett could see an extension coming his way. Buchholz could get dealt, resigned or even let go.
At worst, there are three great starters (even Daisuke) locked up until 2012. With Casey Kelly progressing well through the system, decent outings from young guys like Junichi Tazawa and Michael Bowden, do we really need the 22 year old Cuban-defector flamethrower?
The short answer is no. The long answer is, well, maybe.
There's no doubt the story of Aroldis Chapman is riveting. Born to a boxing trainer, Chapman decided to start playing Baseball when his best friend pressured him into playing first base. He switched to pitcher and never looked back since. He failed on his first defection attempt, was forced to meet with Raul Castro, was suspended from play and then suddenly reactivated. On July 1, 2009, Chapman walked out the front door of his team's Rotterdam hotel, got into his friend's car, and suddenly became a free man, and more importantly a free agent.
Its a great story. From his daughter who was born days before his defection, to the miracle that was him being allowed to hold on to his passport when arriving in Rotterdam. One day, he'll make a great character in a movie.
But, the question remains, will he make a great pitcher? Will he be, as he aspires to be, the greatest pitcher in the game? Nobody knows. Purportedly, Chapman's fastball tops 100 MPH on a good day, yet he has very little control over it. He has a large repertoire, but doesn't do much of it spectacularly. Due to the fact that he arrived with nothing more than a pack of cigarettes in his possession, no one even knows his medical history (although its unlikely he's ever sustained an injury, having completed ever season he's had the opportunity to).
The scouts agree that with enough time spent working on the mechanics and maturity in the minors, he really could be something special. Comparisons abound to top draft pick Stephen Strasburg. Strasburg might be more polished an majors-ready (he's likely the Nats top starter) but Chapman's stuff could be just as good.
Chapman, however, doesn't want to spend his first few years in the minors. He wants to be the best...today. But if he really wants to be a force in the bigs, the first thing he needs to learn is patience.
So, is Aroldis Chapman worth the effort for Boston?
I would argue, for $15.5M, sure. For more then $20M, no chance. This is a player who is, at best, a prospect. He's a good year from the majors at least. There are things to fix, adjustments to make, and attitudes to change. If all goes according to plan, he could be unlike anything seen in baseball before.
He could help bolster a somewhat wavering selection of pitching prospects. Eventually, he could be a great Fenway Park draw, with a competitive personality and a confident swagger that makes him sound like a combination of Papelbon and Pedro. This guy really thinks he's the best. Does that sound like someone I'd want on the mount for 6-8 innings? Absolutely.
If not, he'll just be a great story and a reach fantasy pick. He'll put the Sox over the luxury cap and we'll get nothing real in return. The mechanics will fall apart and he'll never master his repertoire. His attitude will flame up, the Sox will play him too soon, and the rising star will quickly be extinguished.
I think if the Sox can get him under 20, I say go for it. There are so many questions, the money is worth the process of answering them. Anymore than that, I'd say let the Angels have fun with him.
What do you think?
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Not at 23 million
The chances that this kid succeeds just is not worth the money. Yes, he can throw 100 mph at times but he got raked by the Aussies and Japan in the WBC. There are some who believe he is not a starter but a reliever and a 23 million dollar contract is just too rich for a guy who might pitch an inning a game.
RP
$23M for a reliver over 5 years is just over $4.5M per year. To put that into perspective, Papelbon got, I believe, $10M THIS YEAR.
I’d offer $22.5M over 5 years or $24M over 6 years.
First of all, Papelbon was paid $6.25M this year, not $10M. Second, Papelbon is a proven major league reliever – and one of the best – in his arbitration years. Chapman will be starting in the minors.
Based on your argument, we should be paying Casey Kelly the same as Jon Lester. They’re both starting pitchers, after all. Who cares that one of them is a MLB veteran while the other’s starting at AA?
Chapman isn't ready to pitch in the Major Leagues...
He has to coached, poked and prodded before being let loose on mound in the AL East. The Sox are paying for his potential, not his present value. His present value isn’t worth much, after he hits the black paint, has 2-3 pitches, can make batter swing out of the strike zone, then he is ready for a MLB start…
I tend to agree
I gotta go 'cause I'm probably definitely gonna nod out again.
by Drugs Delaney on Jan 8, 2010 4:19 PM EST up reply actions
it depends..
Like any risk management decision with a large amount of money. It really isn’t about Chapman, but if the organization can groomed and train someone like Chapman to be a Johan Santana starting pitcher, instead of turning out a Jose Contreas…. If the Sox sees the potential, then they should go ahead with trying to get Chapman..
Forget if he can throw 100mph. What is his mental make up, much like how NFL teams look at how linebackers can deal with playing in pain, can Chapman handle pressure cooker situations, does he have late movement on his pitches? I think late movement is the tool pitching coaches should look for than high heat.
Johan Santana took years of TLC with the Twins before he could show his lights out potential, and of course screw up his elbow by throwing one too many sliders.
Another thing is Chapman’s mechanics. They have to see if he has the potential in being a Cy Young candidate rather than a Tommy John Candidate..
I think another key is that if he is really good, he is a good trade bait or future trades..
Actually if his mechanics and release point are the same for his...
change up and his fastball, then I would be drooling. I don’t care about the speed as much as location and deception..
Why Randy Johnson was a HOF pitcher was his evil wingspan, having 100 mph fastballs coming from the first baseline will put batters on both sides of the plate at unease.
Need? No. Want? Yes!
Did they need Lackey? No. But like Chapman, they want Chapman as he could be a very valuable piece. I wouldn’t go more than $20M. I worry about his rumored questionable work ethic and whether he can stick as a starter. However, he has huge upside all young players come with a certain amount of risk. If he was a lock to be a perennial Cy Young award contender, he would be getting $20M/year, not over the course of 5 years.
its still really weird to think
that john lackey is a red sox. its just bizarre that we got him. i guess it hasn’t sunk in yet.
Every time I start thinking too much about it...
I get a headache.
Galactus does as he pleases. Because Galactus is drunk.
I have a five-tool player in my pants.
RE:
When it comes to prospects, there is never a “ceiling” in my opinion to how much talent you can have in the system. But money certainly has a ceiling. It always has a ceiling.
With regards to Chapman individually, I’m worried about his control. Control is hard to thing to teach. You either have it or you don’t. It doesn’t matter if you’re a lefty and throw a 100 mpj — because if you can’t hit the strikezone, you’re going to be a loser.
Great first post, politik. Welcome to OTM.
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Not necessarily
Olney had a piece on this guy – who apparently some people compare Chapman to – and how he didn’t learn to harness his control until he was 29.
That said, I’d rather let Chapman learn how to strikes on someone else’s dime.
Manny ain't the only bad man.
Well, if Nolan Ryan can diagnose any possible control issues in Chapman, than all the more power to him.
USG
Wow.
I never knew this story -
Johnson credits a session with Nolan Ryan late in the 1992 season with helping him take his career to the next level; Ryan has said that he appreciated Johnson’s talent and did not want to see him take as long to figure certain things out as he had taken. Ryan recommended a slight change in his delivery; before the meeting, Johnson would land on the heel of his foot after delivering a pitch, and as such, he usually landed offline from home plate. Ryan suggested that he land on the ball of his foot, and almost immediately, he began finding the strike zone more consistently.
(Warning, from wiki)
Seems like a relatively straightforward mechanical fix.
Manny ain't the only bad man.
Yup
Now, if that’s the problem with Chapman’s questionable control, then sign me up.
If not, then that anecdote is a little inconsequential.
USG
This point is that control problems can sometimes be fixed.
But it’s probably worth it to let someone else take that risk. If he turns into something really special, sign him as a FA in five years, at age 26.
Manny ain't the only bad man.
After reading more about Chapman..
He is not worth the money. He is still really rough, and it is unlikely he will be MLB ready for years. He also sounds that he has an ego the size of Havana, which may be the biggest impediment in being coached and groomed as top MLB pitcher. Ignore if he can throw a high heat fast ball, it is location that counts, he needs a couple other pitches that have the same release point as his fastball, and his mechanics have to be good, so he does shred his shoulder..
I am also one of those people that believes that Stephen Strasburg is way, way overhyped. No matter the crap coming out of the Gnats and the Boras camp, Strasburg is still more than two seasons away from pitching in the majors.
I mean l love the stuff that David Price throws, but he still has shown he needs to be back at Durham at AAA level for his control issues. Much like Scott Kazmir showed flashes of dominance when he wasn’t hitting the backstop or batting helmets from his wild pitches..
I think Strasburg is for real.
Or at least he has a good chance of being for real.
And I’d be surprised if he wasn’t in the majors this year. It’s not like he’s being blocked by anyone, or whether him getting up to speed is going to cost them a playoff berth. Zack Greinke and King Felix a couple recent examples of guys given the chance to develop on a lousy ML team.
Manny ain't the only bad man.
he isn't for real right now.
He has some serious potential, but going from 3 innings +/- for each start in the Arizona Fall League to a starting pitcher for a major league team is a recipe for a disaster. It doesn’t matter if he can throw 103 mph, or not. He already dislocated his knee and missed a start.. He needs some time in the minors..
If he is going to be called up to the major leagues, he should be a 7th to 8th inning bridge/reliever. If he is going to be starting pitcher, he needs 2-3 other decent pitches. Ignore his SDU stats, because there is a world of difference between college hitters and MLB hitters..
I wouldn't be surprised to see him as a piggyback starter.
Unless the Nats actually think they can make the playoffs, it should bring people to the park.
USG
by Ben Buchanan on Jan 10, 2010 10:41 AM EST up reply actions
Unless he is absolutely destroying minor league hitters, I’m hoping the Nats keep him on the farm until September, if not all of 2010. He needs to build up his innings and refine his pitches. He can hit the ground running and hopefully dominate in 2011. However, the temptation to appease the fan base and have him take his lumps in 2010 may be too strong.
Daily Dish has Chapman near to signed with the Jays.
Galactus does as he pleases. Because Galactus is drunk.
I have a five-tool player in my pants.
Jeff Passan Tweet:
Cuban LHP Aroldis Chapman agrees to $30M deal with National League team, according to source. Left Ft. Lauderdale airport this a.m. to sign.
Way too much if true
DFA Beckett
by South Coast Ghost on Jan 10, 2010 12:59 PM EST reply actions

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