New York Yankeees and Boston Red Sox in playoffs again. How baseball reflects the real world
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I'm just messing with the poster.
He hates grammar Nazis.
@bs_uf15bosox9be The Original Gameday; Learn to use SB Nation
Tampa Bay Rays went to the world series last year
and they’re poor as shit. Pirates and Orioles have been mired in shittiness because of poor management. Marlins have the lowest payroll in baseball and have won 2 WS in the past 10 years because they draft well and trade their good players right before they hit free agency. Go cry somewhere else. PS Marc Bulger SUCKS.
Strikeouts are boring- Besides that, they're fascist. Throw some ground balls - it's more democratic.
+1
And as a Rams fan, +100000 on Bulger sucking.
by Gnick on Sep 26, 2009 9:34 PM EDT up reply actions
Oh, Andy. So angry.
But since you call yourself AngryAndy and refuse to use your ENTER button to create actual paragraphs, I just assume that you are just a stream-of-consciousness pissy tool and as such your little rant is not worth reading.
Now, your Waaaaaaaaahmbulance is parked outside to take you back to the Boo-Hoo Home.
Goddamn that DeMarlo Hale.
You sir, are a moron. I’m sure you have never heard of the luxury tax before. You know, how the Big Market teams pay millions of dollars a year to the “less fortunate” ones?
Last 10 seasons, AL and NL champions:
1999 New York Yankees/Atlanta Braves
2000 New York Yankees/New York Mets
2001 Arizona Diamondbacks/New York Yankees
2002 Anaheim Angels/San Francisco Giants
2003 Florida Marlins/New York Yankees
2004 Boston Red Sox /St. Louis Cardinals
2005 Chicago White Sox/Houston Astros
2006 St. Louis Cardinals/Detroit Tigers
2007 Boston Red Sox/Colorado Rockies
2008 Philadelphia Phillies/Tampa Bay Rays
If thats not enough competition maybe the WNBA will suit you.
And please, don’t turn this into a Capitalism debate. I’m just itching to go off into a anti-Socialist rant.
No politics, ritz.
We save that stuff for the offseason. :)
@bs_uf15bosox9be The Original Gameday; Learn to use SB Nation
But he's just a fan.
He can’t be expected to help his own cause.
Did I just totally rip apart his political argument too?
@bs_uf15bosox9be The Original Gameday; Learn to use SB Nation
f*ck football. i hate all the damn posers who are all all like “baseball sucks” blah blah capitalism. i just joined this (im a yankee fan) to say. boo hoo.go cry to mommy. what do the steelers do? the patriots? thye always seem to be in. boring huh?
Well there is a salary cap in football
So the Patriots and Steelers success can be attributed to very intelligent management.
by Gnick on Sep 27, 2009 3:27 PM EDT up reply actions
Baseball probably bores you because you really aren't a baseball fan
Here are a few points:
(1) The MFY and Sox aren’t the top two payrolls. The MFY are tops. The Sox are fourth.
(2) Last year, the three highest payrolls in baseball—the MFY, Tigers, and Mets—missed the playoffs.
(3) This year, two of the top three—Mets and Cubs—won’t be playing in October.
(4) In 7 of the last 13 years in the AL, there was at least a 50% turnover in playoff teams from the previous year (in 3 of those years the turnover was 75%). In the NL, there was a 50% turnover in 12 of 13 years (in 4 of those years the turnover was 75% and 1 year it was 100%). The Braves and MFY were the only constants for most of that period.
Many consider the NFL to be a model league in terms parity between teams. However, football has always had a higher turnover rate than baseball because the season is shorter (making the impact of injuries greater) and more teams make the postseason. From 1995 (the year after the cap) to 2008, the turnover rate in the AFC was 50% or more in 9 of 14 years. In the NFC, it was 10 of 14 years. Of the 9 years in the AFC where at least 50% of the playoff teams differed from the previous year, in only three was the percentage of change greater than 50%. In the NFC, only 4 times was the percentage over 50%. Unlike MLB, there hasn’t been a 100% turnover from one year to the next in either conference. Only two seasons had a greater than two-thirds turnover (both times in the NFC).
The NFL turnover numbers really aren’t that different from MLB. More importantly, they really aren’t that much different from the pre-salary cap NFL. So any difference between football and baseball in terms of competitiveness has more to do with the nature of the two sports than disparities in team payroll.
Since 1995, when baseball went to the Wild Card, only three teams have never been in the post-season: Toronto, Pittsburgh, and Washington (Montreal). Every team except the expansion Houston Texans (7 seasons) has made the NFL post-season since 1994. Considering that more teams make the playoffs in football this really isn’t surprising. Here’s a breakdown of the number of times each team has been to the playoffs (baseball teams, in bold, since 1995 and football teams since 1995:
12
MFY
11
Braves, Colts
10
Packers, Patriots, Steelers
9
Eagles
8
Red Sox, Cowboys, Vikings
7
Indians, Broncos, Giants, 49ers, Bucs
6
Astros, Jaguars, Chargers, Seahawks, Titans
5
A’s, Angels, Dodgers, Falcons, Ravens, Chiefs, Jets, Rams
4
Mariners, Twins, D-Backs, Cubs, Padres, Giants, Bills, Panthers, Bears, Lions
3
Rangers, White Sox, Mets, Raiders, Redskins
2
Orioles, Rockies, Marlins, Phillies, Cardinals, Browns, Saints
1
Rays, Reds, Tigers, Brewers, Bengals
It looks like the usual suspects also make the playoffs the most in football. Of the three teams in baseball that haven’t made the playoffs, only Toronto is kind of a hard luck case. The Jays have had some decent teams that played in tough divisions. And, they made the playoffs four times in five seasons prior to the change in baseball’s playoff structure, from 1989-1993. Pittsburgh and Washington suck because of bad management.
One last point: when the MFY won their championships—1996, 1998, 1999, and 2000—the disparity in payrolls between the top teams was not nearly as great as it is now. In other words, they didn’t really have the “unfair” advantage they’ve had in their recent—non-championship—years.
I gotta go 'cause I'm probably definitely gonna nod out again.
by Drugs Delaney on Sep 27, 2009 2:00 AM EDT reply actions 7 recs
Angryandy: You've been DD'd !
"That was a lot of fun… You just keep pounding balls into the gap. The one thing you don’t want to do is hit a home run. That’s a rally-killer." Jeff Francoeur
by radiohix on Sep 27, 2009 3:12 AM EDT up reply actions 2 recs
and hix-- you get a rec
"You know," Girardi said, shrugging his shoulders, "it didn't work."
( Joe Girardi on pitching to Manny Ramirez with first base open)
I think
wearing an ‘I heart Drugs’ shirt would confuse many & send the wrong message so I will say this: You are the best, Drugs!! ( that is funny as well).
Drugs, I don’t know what you do in your real life but it certainly should be sports-related. You are more than a fan, your insight always fascinates me.
"You know," Girardi said, shrugging his shoulders, "it didn't work."
( Joe Girardi on pitching to Manny Ramirez with first base open)
You're right MassGal
Drugs is the OTM nation national treasure! Can’t say enough about the guy…too much respect!
"That was a lot of fun… You just keep pounding balls into the gap. The one thing you don’t want to do is hit a home run. That’s a rally-killer." Jeff Francoeur
Thanks
But I just realized I forgot to add MassGal’s favorite team, the Dolphins, to the list. They made the playoffs 8 times. My oversight must have something to do with my Pats-related biases. Sorry, MassGal. :)
I gotta go 'cause I'm probably definitely gonna nod out again.
by Drugs Delaney on Sep 27, 2009 1:27 PM EDT up reply actions
Well, how about this for a t-shirt?
wearing an ‘I heart Drugs’ shirt would confuse many & send the wrong message
You could wear a shirt that said “Double D”……
Hmm, maybe that’s not a very good idea, either. :P
Goddamn that DeMarlo Hale.
Rec'd, because it's long and looks fun to read.
Will get around to it eventually.
@bs_uf15bosox9be The Original Gameday; Learn to use SB Nation
Maybe we should look at divisional races to don't you think
If you dont like me please ignore me and my posts
The Pirates,Reds,Royals, and Padres are not major league teams
Anyone who complains about the Red Sox and Yankees spending too much on FA's
and wants things equal, should have to also pay the same price to attend games, parking, etc… as fans of these teams do. If you are not willing to spend what we spend then shut the fuck up.
VARITEK MUST GO
Brandon Webb in 2010
by gizmosandy on Sep 27, 2009 11:07 AM EDT reply actions 2 recs
So bigger markets get automatically better teams year after year..not fair
If you dont like me please ignore me and my posts
The Pirates,Reds,Royals, and Padres are not major league teams
What's your definition of big market?
Is it based on market size, fan base, or how much ownership is willing to spend? Chicago is a much bigger city than Boston. Are the White Sox and Cubs bigger market teams than the Red Sox? The Cubs spend more than the Red Sox. Can two teams in the same city be considered as coming from the same market if one is more popular?
Based on population, Boston is the 22nd largest city in the US. New York (MFY, Mets), LA (Dodgers, Angels), Chicago (Cubs, White Sox), Houston (Astros), Dallas (Rangers), San Diego (Padres), Detroit (Tigers), San Francisco (Giants), and Baltimore (Orioles) have greater populations that Boston. Boston has a slightly larger population than Milwaukee (Brewers), Denver (Rockies), and Seattle (Mariners).
If you want to look at metropolitan areas, greater Boston is 10th behind NY/NJ (4 times greater) LA (3 times greater), Chicago (more than twice the population), Dallas-Fort Worth-Arlington (almost 50% larger), Philadelphia (roughly 30% larger), Houston (roughly 30% larger), Miami-Fort Lauderdale-etc. (20% larger), Atlanta (roughly 20% larger), and DC-Arlington-Alexandria (roughly 20% larger). Greater Detroit and San Francisco are slightly smaller.
Your concerns are more about money than market size. That has more to do with ownership. The former owner of the Twins, Carl Pohlad, was one of the richest owners. Yet he spent very little on his team. The Pohlads and Jeffrey Lorias of this world are more to blame than the Steinbrenners for the disparity in team payrolls because they pocket the luxury tax money, provided by large-payroll teams, rather than use it along with their own funds to make their teams more competitive.
Can baseball do more? Sure. But salary caps just make owners richer. They do little to alter the competitive balance. Look at hockey, basketball, and football before and after the cap and you’ll see very little difference—except that there is greater player movement and more mediocre teams. What those three sports have in common are shorter seasons and more teams making the playoffs. Since 2000, here are the champions of each sport:
2000: MFY (MLB) – Ravens (NFL) – Lakers (NBA) – Devils (NHL)
2001: D-Backs (MLB) – Patriots (NFL) – Lakers (NBA) – Avalanche (NHL)
2002: Angels (MLB) – Buccaneers (NFL) – Lakers (NBA) – Red Wings (NHL)
2003: Marlins (MLB) – Patriots (NFL) – Spurs (NBA) – Devils (NHL)
2004: Red Sox (MLB) – Patriots (NFL) – Pistons (NBA) – Lightning (NHL)
2005: White Sox (MLB) – Steelers (NFL) – Spurs (NBA) –
2006: Cardinals (MLB) – Colts (NFL) – Heat (NBA) – Hurricanes (NHL)
2007: Red Sox (MLB) – Giants (NFL) – Spurs (NBA) – Ducks (NHL)
2008: Phillies (MLB) – Steelers (NFL) – Celtics (NBA) – Red Wings (NHL)
2009: – Lakers (NBA) – Penguins (NHL)
In that time, MLB saw only one team win multiplechampionships, the Red Sox (2). The NFL had two multiple winners: the Pats (3) and Steelers (2). In the NBA, the Lakers won 4 championships and the Spurs won 3. The Red Wings and Devils were the Stanley Cup champs twice. Based on this, MLB must be doing something right.
I gotta go 'cause I'm probably definitely gonna nod out again.
by Drugs Delaney on Sep 28, 2009 9:59 AM EDT up reply actions 3 recs
Rec'd
Is that legal, pocketing luxury tax money? Seems shady…
by Black Yen Power G-Man Spy on Sep 28, 2009 10:21 AM EDT up reply actions
Rec'd.
Why aren’t you writing for this site in an official capacity, Drugs? I’m surprised Randy hasn’t roped you in yet.
Boston is actually a much more populous region by the measure Combined Statistical Area (or Commuting Region), by which it ranks 5th. This is ahead of regions like Philly, Dallas-Fort Worth, San Francisco, Houston and Atlanta. The Red Sox arguably have a huge geographical advantage over many other teams, as they dominate the New England area, and even into Canada. Furthermore, the regions ahead of it – NYC, LA, Chicago, and Baltimore-Washington – all have two teams splitting the market.
I think for the above reasons, the Red Sox could easily outspend all of the other teams, except the Yankees, by a significant margin (say $20 – $30 million). However the team’s management has concluded they can be successful without spending like drunken sailors. Moreover, any free agent / international signing the Sox want is a likely target of New York as well, making straight bidding wars pointless.
"It's just a tiny little nick, but it hurts when I get champagne in there."
- Jason Bay, on getting spiked scoring the winning run in ALDS Game Four.
Re: I’m surprised Randy hasn’t roped you in yet.
Randy probably doesn’t want to deal with my agent, Scott Boras. As a Type-A FA, I’d cost a lot in picks and money. OTM has a strong farm system. Look at the strong picks Randy has made. USG and BS are are very good. SoxDevil is a steady performer. Allen Chace has missed an awful lot of time this year. But, I’m expecting big things from him in the playoffs.
I gotta go 'cause I'm probably definitely gonna nod out again.
by Drugs Delaney on Sep 30, 2009 3:21 PM EDT up reply actions
Perfectly played.
And for that you receive the REC. Congratulations…you’ve earned it.
Goddamn that DeMarlo Hale.
This.
Oh, and I’m the Gonzo of the writers.
@bs_uf15bosox9be The Original Gameday; Learn to use SB Nation
No, I'm just saying that I'm barely putting up average stuff.
And that I might start to suck if I get really stressed.
@bs_uf15bosox9be The Original Gameday; Learn to use SB Nation
I've been away from the Sox for a month,
but did anyone else think bs was proclaiming himself the Hunter S. Thompson of OTM writers?
"Ninety percent [of my salary] I'll spend on good times, women, and Irish whiskey. The other ten percent I'll probably waste."
-Tug McGraw
The fact that I had to Google that should answer your question.
Sounds like the kind of reporter I hate though.
@bs_uf15bosox9be The Original Gameday; Learn to use SB Nation
I mean the whole "make yourself the story" thing.
@bs_uf15bosox9be The Original Gameday; Learn to use SB Nation
Hunter S. Thompson was the absolute man.
Not really a reporter though. You should read Fear and Loathing. Or watch one of the movies about him (bill Murray and Johnny Depp both play Hunter S. Thompson). He was also one of the original espn.com Page 2 columnists, and those columns were an absolute trip.
"Ninety percent [of my salary] I'll spend on good times, women, and Irish whiskey. The other ten percent I'll probably waste."
-Tug McGraw
Why are you complaining about the Yankees?
The red sox made it to the playoffs too. Stop worrying about the Yankees and start worrying about The Red Sux.
"Don't let your fears of striking out keep you from playing the game."

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