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No More Complaining About Payrolls for Red Sox Fans

It was always a comfortable, if perhaps not entirely respectable fallback to point at the Yankees' payroll. It was not the most valid of excuses--fans of small market teams would be and were entirely justified at laughing their heads off at the $120 million giant crying about cash. But the Yankees' $200 million was a clear outlier, heads and tails above the #2 team in the league.

Red Sox fans will have to give up that excuse in 2010, though. Sure, barring more signings, the Yankees will still be ahead of the Red Sox by a fair amount. But as it stands now, with the Yankees aiming at a reported $185 million figure and the Red Sox standing around $150 million--give or take a few million based on arbitration guesses--the Yankees are not in a league of their own anymore. While last year only the smallest market teams in the league could claim that the Sox had as much an advantage over them as the Yankees did over the Sox, this year it will likely be well over half the teams in the league.

Star-divide

The $150 million will not all be on the field for the Sox. $9 million comes from Julio Lugo, who was traded to the Cardinals last year on the condition that the Sox pay for him. Mike Lowell, though he's still with the team for now, could also well be in Texas within the week, still costing the Sox $9 million himself. Add in $1.5 million in buyouts, and that's nearly $20 million in bad contract money.

But what impact does this have on the average reader? Well, to start with, it's gonna be tough to expect any more signings this year. Matt Holliday is almost certainly out. Jason Bay will join him. Instead, if the organization is willing to go all out this year, expect at most mid-money, 1-year contracts. Say, Mike Cameron. Given the hole at 3B, and $3 million potentially coming off the books from a Lowell trade, even Adrian Beltre is not impossible. But if anyone was expecting a big push in the outfield department, think again.

Popular thinking has the Red Sox shipping Clay Buchholz and others off to the Padres in a deal for Adrian Gonzalez, and while Adrian Gonzalez has a very team-friendly contract at the moment, that's bound to change within the next few years. I doubt the Sox would be willing to invest not only Clay Buchholz, but also Casey Kelly or Ryan Westmoreland in any deal for Adrian Gonzalez that does not also include an extension. Any extension would cost a great deal of money, even considering discounts given a guaranteed raise over the years remaining on his current contract. Even with a Lowell trade, Gonzalez would likely put the Sox at around $160 million even without a left fielder. The rumor of Mike Cameron would put that number closer to an incredible $170 million.

Also at issue is next year's payroll. Assuming a $170 million dollar payroll this year, the Red Sox will have a number of unpopular contracts coming off their books. But just how much spending money will that result in? First, both "bad contracts" come off the board for $20 million. Then there's David Ortiz' $13 million, Josh Beckett's $12 million, Jason Varitek's $3 million, and Victor Martinez' $7.7 million. After losing all that, the Sox will barely be under the $120 million they spent in 2009. And that's not even factoring in raises! Youkilis gets $3 million more. Daisuke is up $2 million, Lester adds $2 million, and Pedroia $2 million. Let's mercifully assume that the Red Sox' 7 players going to their next year in Arbitration adds only $10-15 million, and we're still left with Ellsbury and Buchholz starting their first arbitration years, and due for probably $8 million between them at least. A conservative estimate puts the Red Sox well over $140 million starting 2010's offseason, and that's without a catcher, DH, and one top-of-the-rotation pitcher. Forget about Joe Mauer, this team might not be willing to sign A.J. Pierzynski.

There are 2 directions the Sox front office could go with. Either this is an all-out gamble for the next few years, with money on the Sox' prospects coming through to fill in holes (Either Exposito, Wagner, or possibly Max Ramirez at catcher, maybe Lars at DH), or the Red Sox' ownership is committing to setting a new bar for payroll. If this isn't just a flash in the pan of spending, then it's official: we're rivaling the Yankees, and it's time to swallow our jeers and, quite frankly, show some shame. I, for one, have been calling for a salary cap and floor for years, and I will not stop doing so now just because we're now spending as much as our greatest enemies. But I will probably talk quieter, and I'll expect even more derision for it.

Either way, though, at least those $5 ticket hikes are going to the right places.

 

Innumerable thanks to Cot's Baseball Contracts for so many numbers in this piece. Fantastic site for anything contract related.

0 recs  |  Comment 58 comments |

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Becoming that which you hate.

Bloody swell.

Galactus does as he pleases. Because Galactus is drunk.

by Bloggy on Dec 14, 2009 7:33 PM EST reply actions  

Feels dirty, doesn't it?

I didn’t realize payroll would be so nuts with any FA signing, though. I guess the fact that it left a hole open was the kicker.

USG

by Ben Buchanan on Dec 14, 2009 7:38 PM EST up reply actions  

A sad day for me as a member of the nation

Becoming the MFY bis! Just kill me now!

To zobrist; verb – to overlook the superiority of a person or object based on misleading sensory or conversational factors. e.g. "My teacher totally zobristed me on that paper – I’d included all the points he asked for but I didn’t drone on about Grover Cleveland enough. He’s totally biased towards Cleveland. What’s worse is that Danny Dukowski got an A, and his prose style is terrible. He’s a total Victorino." deadspy3 - Amazin' Avenue

by bloodysock04 on Dec 14, 2009 7:36 PM EST reply actions  

hard to say

until the year happens, but it seems pretty accurate. Depending on which players we lose and gain in the meantime.

by wolf9309 on Dec 15, 2009 12:32 AM EST up reply actions  

Let's assume a $170 million payroll this year.

That’s still around $30 million less than the Yankees. The Sox may be spending like drunken Yankees, but they haven’t become them yet. Anyway, this kind of binge should kill all talk of a ‘bridge year.’

"It's just a tiny little nick, but it hurts when I get champagne in there."
- Jason Bay, on getting spiked scoring the winning run in ALDS Game Four.

by 0157H7 on Dec 14, 2009 7:46 PM EST reply actions  

I doubt the market can handle any player's payroll over $150 million for the Sox.

The Boston/New England market is more comparable to the SF Bay Area market, still large, but it isn’t compare to the Southern California or Chicagoland market. The Sox have an incredible fanbase, but the Sox have to some sort of net profit, no matter how slim so they don’t get in a financial quandry as other teams like Texas and Detroit are in right now.

  It isn’t just players payroll, Baseball teams have a large amount of employees whether seasonal or full time, that is bunch of overhead that sucks revenue dry.

It isn’t just payroll, but there is going to be an inherent risk of signing players to long lucrative contracts, and the chances of them getting injured or decline in performance mean the contract is worth much more than the player true value.

  

by superferret on Dec 14, 2009 10:46 PM EST up reply actions  

The Sox don't own NESN outright..

The New York Times, (technically a minority owner of the Sox) is trying to sell their 17% share of NESN, the Bruins/Jeremy Jacobs owns 20% of NESN, so the Sox own give or take 53% of NESN.

   NESN is a huge advantage for the Sox, and an excellent revenue stream, but the New England Market is still a smaller share than the New York/New Jersey/Southern CT market or the Southern Californian market.

   The Yankees and the Sox are the two bruisers in Major League Baseball. They are probably the most lucrative teams and highest value. The Dodgers should had been no# 2 in value, (they were for many years, maybe even no# 1) but after Peter O’Malley sold them in 1998, it has been downhill for the Dodgers. Both the Angels and the Dodgers don’t own their broadcasting rights.

If any other baseball team has a higher value than the Sox, it is the Mets, but it depends.

by superferret on Dec 15, 2009 2:05 AM EST up reply actions  

As an aside...

… as a guess, $ 152MM including arb + whatever third base costs – which includes $ 19.5MM in dead salary ($ 22.5MM if you include Varitek’s player option in “dead salary,” har har).

Rock me, sexy Jesus...

by nuthinboutnuthin on Dec 15, 2009 2:18 AM EST up reply actions  

WAIT!

I read numerous boards and all I have been reading is Theo’s done nothing, the Yankees are singing everyone, Sox tickets prices are so high and we don’t sign anyone or make a big splash, what are Henry and Co doing with our monwy

Now I’m reading that we might have a large payroll and that’s bad

I’m confused…

by BobZupcic on Dec 14, 2009 7:48 PM EST reply actions  

Well

the Yankees are not going to stick at 185. I am not sure they are at 185 even now. But really the thought of the Sox hitting 170 is grotesque. I don’t think of the Sox as anything other than a big market team, but 170 is a whole new ballgame.

by Buzzy on Dec 14, 2009 7:48 PM EST reply actions  

it's a ton

if we weren’t in the same division as the MFY, it would be grotesque, but they got there first and we gotta compete.

by wolf9309 on Dec 15, 2009 12:33 AM EST up reply actions  

i say no

All we can do now is win. It’ll be tough, but we can handle it.

by wolf9309 on Dec 15, 2009 12:36 AM EST up reply actions  

Here's the thing

The Sox offered Bay $15 million/year. That’s only -2 from what Lackey will be earning. So to keep the same team from last year, plus a $6M shortstop, the Sox were going to spend at least $15M, keeping the Red Sox in the same area where they are now.

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Follow Randy on Twitter: @RCBooth

by Randy Booth on Dec 14, 2009 7:50 PM EST reply actions  

My point:

This was unavoidable.

SB Nation's Boston Red Sox community:
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by Randy Booth on Dec 14, 2009 7:50 PM EST up reply actions  

Which would put us up.

But by signing a SP they didn’t necessarily need, they added a whole new number to the ballgame. And considering that Lowell is looking like at least $9 million in sunken costs, and you’ve got to add a surprise ~$8 million for Beltre or more for Gonzalez. And then there’s our random “Spend $400,000 on every relief pitcher available” plan. And Paps getting more money. And the natural arbitration increases. We had limited money coming off the books this year, and we’re spending at pretty close to drunken sailor levels, even if it’s due to some ill fortune.

USG

by Ben Buchanan on Dec 14, 2009 7:55 PM EST up reply actions  

By the way, thank you, Ben Buchanan

…for finding a way to make me hate the Lackey trade on a deeper level.

Galactus does as he pleases. Because Galactus is drunk.

by Bloggy on Dec 14, 2009 7:57 PM EST up reply actions  

I'm gonna start using people's real names from their profiles every time they do this to me.

It may be such a clear abuse of my powers and likely a breach of privacy rules, but by God, it’s gonna be worth losing my position! Just you watch, mister Bloggy Ta—

Dammit.

USG

by Ben Buchanan on Dec 14, 2009 8:00 PM EST up reply actions  

Heh.

Heh heh.

Galactus does as he pleases. Because Galactus is drunk.

by Bloggy on Dec 14, 2009 8:04 PM EST up reply actions  

Wait you can see our real names?

……awkward……

"Hating the New York Yankees is as American as apple pie, unwed mothers and cheating on your income tax." -- Mike Royko

by sox-inda-south on Dec 14, 2009 8:26 PM EST up reply actions  

I bet you have no on earthly idea how to say mine.

Haha! But I’m only months away from leaving SIS and assuming a new identity.

So want to tell me who was “Julio Lugo” on OTM last July?

"Hating the New York Yankees is as American as apple pie, unwed mothers and cheating on your income tax." -- Mike Royko

by sox-inda-south on Dec 14, 2009 8:29 PM EST up reply actions  

He has yet to post in this topic.

And I believe he is asleep right now.

That last bit should hopefully freak you out a bit. >_>

USG

by Ben Buchanan on Dec 14, 2009 8:30 PM EST up reply actions  

Okay......I still have no idea.......

….but I’m going to get back to my mid-term exam studying and stop being creeped out…..

"Hating the New York Yankees is as American as apple pie, unwed mothers and cheating on your income tax." -- Mike Royko

by sox-inda-south on Dec 14, 2009 8:36 PM EST up reply actions  

IT WAS ME!!! THE WHOLE TIME!!!

(no it wasn’t)

Galactus does as he pleases. Because Galactus is drunk.

by Bloggy on Dec 14, 2009 8:38 PM EST up reply actions  

At least we're making the team better

And outside of the Lackey signing, it’s not by signing big named free agents. We didn’t sign three this offseason (like the Yanks last year) and the Sox won’t. The money ends up the same, but the perception won’t because the Sox only signed one “big name.”

SB Nation's Boston Red Sox community:
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Follow Randy on Twitter: @RCBooth

by Randy Booth on Dec 14, 2009 8:00 PM EST up reply actions  

True

But the Lacky signing is what makes this more than just being a quick bump. We’ve seen the Sox hit $150 million or so before. $170 million is a new frontier.

Of course, that’s assuming we sign a 3B and LF at about $10 million a piece, so it’s a little high. But still.

USG

by Ben Buchanan on Dec 14, 2009 8:03 PM EST up reply actions  

$143 million in 2007.

Then again, that was a good year.

USG

by Ben Buchanan on Dec 14, 2009 8:04 PM EST up reply actions  

Sensing a Trade

Either in season or after

Papelbon? Beckett?

by BobZupcic on Dec 14, 2009 7:52 PM EST reply actions  

Actually, I also had that thought.

But if they’re trading Beckett, there was no reason not to just resign him at around the same money and pass on Lackey. Papelbon would make more sense, but the bullpen is going to need to show some remarkable cohesion aside from him to make the Sox confident enough.

USG

by Ben Buchanan on Dec 14, 2009 7:56 PM EST up reply actions  

Beckett

If they can re-sign him or negotiations break down.

If the Sox faltered, and look like the Cleveland Indians of 2009, there will be a dump, from Beckett, Paps, and even Papi if he has a decent year.

by superferret on Dec 14, 2009 10:50 PM EST up reply actions  

This team, even without any more additions, is way too good to falter like the Indians.

"Ninety percent [of my salary] I'll spend on good times, women, and Irish whiskey. The other ten percent I'll probably waste."
-Tug McGraw

by BTLove on Dec 15, 2009 3:13 AM EST up reply actions  

Here is what I don't understand

How is the number 150? Cots says 80 (without Scuts and Lackey). 6+16.5-3(Lowell)-8(Bay)+(more or less from last year 122) would give as a totally superficial estimate of 134. What did I miss?

by Buzzy on Dec 14, 2009 7:53 PM EST reply actions  

Is the Cots number + Arbitration numbers?

Galactus does as he pleases. Because Galactus is drunk.

by Bloggy on Dec 14, 2009 7:56 PM EST up reply actions  

Don't look at the 2009 numbers, look at the 2010 obligations.

Here
The 2009 chart has some problems, like Beckett charting in at $2 million…

USG

by Ben Buchanan on Dec 14, 2009 7:57 PM EST up reply actions  

still

something seems not right. Are you sure? It says 80. Add VMart+Lackey+Scutaro+9mill of Beckett… and I still am at less than 130??

by Buzzy on Dec 14, 2009 8:31 PM EST up reply actions  

VMart + Lackey + Scutaro + 10 million + Wakefield = +42

That should get you 122.
Add $8-10 million for Papelbon
Other than Papelbon, we have Kotchman and Hermida entering their 2nd or later year in arbitration. Their salaries are not included in the $120 million starting figure, so that’s 6-7 million more. That’s 135 or so.
Okajima, MDC, and Ramon Ramirez are all entering arbitration. That’s another $5 million.
Add any league minimum/miniature contracts (we’re racking them up) and that’s $145 million as a fairly conservative estimate.

USG

by Ben Buchanan on Dec 14, 2009 8:42 PM EST up reply actions  

Papelbon is the big hole.

Arbitration eligible, but in the “I may as well be a FA” way.

USG

by Ben Buchanan on Dec 14, 2009 8:48 PM EST up reply actions  

Cots

Try the 2010-2014 obligations link it is more up to date…I made the same mistake earlier. The correct link has updated Beckett, Scutaro, Martinez, etc. numbers and has us at 108+ prior to Lackey and ARB player estimates

by BobZupcic on Dec 14, 2009 8:40 PM EST reply actions  

So...

Can we whine about payroll or not?

Rock me, sexy Jesus...

by nuthinboutnuthin on Dec 14, 2009 8:52 PM EST reply actions  

Nope

Well, not about it being low.

We can lament about the loss of any slight moral high ground over the MFY though, as far as FA is concerned.

USG

by Ben Buchanan on Dec 14, 2009 8:55 PM EST up reply actions  

Do we still have...

…the slight moral high ground associated with not being the ones who started it?

Hm. Yes, I see your point.

Rock me, sexy Jesus...

by nuthinboutnuthin on Dec 14, 2009 8:57 PM EST up reply actions  

Beckett vs Lackey

Love having Lackey….my main worry is that Beckett is in his walk year….do we re-up? He’ll want as much if not more that Lackey….I’m thinking Josh is not here in 2011

by BobZupcic on Dec 14, 2009 9:08 PM EST reply actions  

I'd re-sign Beckett for the same deal

Depending on his season this year. My fear is he’s too proud to match Lackey’s deal, he’ll want more.

Manny ain't the only bad man.

by tommy.otm on Dec 14, 2009 9:28 PM EST up reply actions  

Welcome to the Dark Side bitches!

Strikeouts are boring- Besides that, they're fascist. Throw some ground balls - it's more democratic.

by CasanovaWong on Dec 14, 2009 9:29 PM EST reply actions  

Congrats on buying the AL Wild Card!

And Pete Abraham with Theo Epstein in that pic is so very appropriate.

by Scooby Snacks on Dec 14, 2009 9:35 PM EST reply actions  

Earlier this offseason, Theo talked about approaching, but not surpassing, the luxury tax threshold of $170M for 2010. So I would not be overly surprised if they were indeed up there in spending. Also, with the tax, the MFY are already spending around $200M for next year.

"Ninety percent [of my salary] I'll spend on good times, women, and Irish whiskey. The other ten percent I'll probably waste."
-Tug McGraw

by BTLove on Dec 15, 2009 3:18 AM EST reply actions  

It wouldn't look so bad if it wasn't for those dead contracts

~$20MM being given to players on other teams (assuming a Lowell deal goes through, and there’s no guarantee of that) is a lot. Way more than any team should be comfortable with, even the Yanks.

DFA Beckett

by South Coast Ghost on Dec 15, 2009 4:14 AM EST reply actions  

This is just symptomatic of MLB economics.

Yes, the Sox are spending a lot. They HAVE to spend a lot.

They are in the same division as the Yankees.

Lets get some basics crystal clear:

1) Spending a ton does not guarantee a World Series title. But
2) Spending more does on average result in more wins.
3) More regular season wins leads to more division titles and
4) Home field advantage, which increases chances of winning playoffs which
5) Increases chances of winning a World Series title.

In the AL East, on average, due to highest payroll, the Yankees will over the course of time win more regular season games and thus win more division titles and more often have home field advantage in the playoffs.

Any team in any other division can spend less than the ’Sox and have a decent chance at a division title and get a taste of home field advantage in the playoffs. Any team in any other division can spend less than the ’Sox and compete with the ’Sox for a wildcard spot.

Here is the kicker -the Sox can out spend everybody but the Yankees, and on average it will net them a wildcard spot, where they will play a lesser-spending team on the road in the playoffs.

This is the basic math of the MLB world as it is currently constructed – because there is no salary cap. Do the math. Yes, there will be exceptions, but those are the trends.

It is a Yankees world and the Sox are just playin’ in it.

by mmmmm on Dec 15, 2009 3:17 PM EST reply actions   1 recs

Nice!

I’ll rec that!

I hope this doesn’t get lost because it’s so far down the page now…this was a really good analysis of the current situation.

Galactus does as he pleases. Because Galactus is drunk.

by Bloggy on Dec 15, 2009 3:30 PM EST up reply actions  

Also...

…every time I read your name I start singing Mmm Mmm Mmm Mmm, by the Crash Test Dummies.

Galactus does as he pleases. Because Galactus is drunk.

by Bloggy on Dec 15, 2009 3:31 PM EST up reply actions  

Look at the St. Petersburg Rays...

 They were so bad for so long, they got great draft picks and most importantly develop them properly, that was one part of the puzzle, They completed another part with the Minnesota trade that got them Matt Garza, and the best pitching rotation in 08. Playing in a Warehouse also helps..

 They were doing all this on a $43 million dollar payroll. However they weren’t bad in 2009, but there are too many variables for this type of team to maintain a dynasty, especially in the cut throat division of the AL East. They just couldn’t afford to plug the gaps in their bullpen and back end of their rotation.

 I think teams can be top of the line in the Twinkies and the A’s scheme of money management, I just don’t see them be dominant year by year. Compare signing the top of the line players as the MFY do.

I think signing Teixiera was a huge help for the Yankees, his defense skills are incredible, however like the Twinkies and the Rays, their stadium also help their winning.

by superferret on Dec 15, 2009 4:29 PM EST up reply actions  

ability to resign players

the problem isn’t just about having money to go out and purchase new free agents. Its also about having the money to KEEP the players that you develop via farm system.

Small market teams can carefully nurture talent from the farm & draft and once in a while it all comes together – perhaps with a sprinkling in of a key FA or two. And clearly a very few teams like Minnesota have the real skill at this. But eventually that homegrown talent reaches contract terminus and you have to pay to keep it.

Thus, as you say, while it is possible for a small market team to get lucky and have everything come together for a run once in a while, the economics of baseball make it virtually impossible to sustain it beyond 2 or three years for most teams before they sink back into mediocrity.

The Yankees can always afford to keep their best homegrown talent, in addition to going out and buying someone else’s.

by mmmmm on Dec 18, 2009 1:27 PM EST up reply actions  

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