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Choosing between Lowrie and Lugo is a toss up


Could Julio Lugo overtake Jed Lowrie for the shortstop job in '09?


Lowrie

Outside of who's behind the plate for the Red Sox on Opening Day, the biggest question mark is up the middle, to the left of the second base bag, deep in the hole. Who's playing there and how well will they perform?

There are only two candidates. The man with the big money, looking to prove he's still got some gas left in the tank and the youngster, who has proved he can play but he isn't in the Hall of Fame just yet.

The descriptions above fit Julio Lugo and Jed Lowrie, respectively. We'll see one of them deep in the hole come April 6 in Fenway Park ... but which one is the real question at hand.

First, let's look at their stats from 2008:

	AB	HR	RBI	BA/OBP/SLG	OPS+
Lowrie	260	2	46	.258/.339/.400	90
Lugo	261	1	22	.268/.355/.330	78

The nice thing about comparing their stats is they played an almost identical amount of time, Lowrie's 260 at-bats to Lugo's 261. With a quick look over their numbers, they don't look to be too much different. Lowrie had a little more power and knocked in a few more runners, while Lugo had a better batting average and got on base at a better clip.

Looking at the future for both hitters, Lowrie can only go up while it's hard to tell what Lugo is capable of. Lugo is a very good hitter at Fenway Park (.301 career at Fenway, .305 last season), but away he struggles. In '07 he hit .190 on the road and .233 last year. Lowrie has potential to be a .300 hitter.

Defensively, it's not even close. Last year Lugo notched 16 errors in 81 games at shortstop. Lowrie committed 0 in 49 games at short and just two in 45 games at third base in Mike Lowell's absence. If I remember correctly, a majority of Lugo's errors came on throws to first base, not necessarily fielding ground balls.

Let's look at at the pros of each being the starter:

FOR LOWRIE:

  • Higher ceiling
  • Better offensive potential
  • Above-average defensive shortstop
  • Proved his worth late in '08/playoffs
  • Allows Lugo to be super utility backup (SS, 2B, 3B, OF)

FOR LUGO:

  • Great hitter at Fenway
  • $$$ (not a big deal to fans, but a big deal to the front office who paid that $$$)
  • Speed: likely the second fastest player on the Red Sox
  • The "revenge" factor: Lugo has a lot to prove

If the Sox had to choose today, the answer would be Lowrie. No doubt about it. But what if the Sox declared the position open to the best player come Spring Training?

I think it would be great for the Sox, Lowrie and Lugo if Terry Francona says in February: "Both of these guys have a lot to offer, so we're going to let Spring Training decide the winner." Lowrie might feel a little slighted if this were to happen, but he's still just a rookie working for a spot against a big money veteran.

Is there a downside to this? If Lugo is under the idea he can win the job back, he's going to go full tilt in Spring Training and no one is going to complain about that. If his numbers are great, Lowrie's are great then the Sox have a hard decision to make but a good decision to make. They could start Lugo and have Lowrie be the backup infielder. Or if Lowrie wins the job, Lugo could be the super utility player or possibly traded because he proved he's still got some skills if Spring Training goes well.

The best part is that the Sox are in a win-win situation. Unless both get hurt, the Red Sox should be all set heading into 2009 at the shortstop position.

0 recs | Comment 74 comments

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Comments

Display:

I'm OK with whichever player wins the job

Even a Lowrie/Lugo platoon is better than watching Alex Cora’s corpse decompose at SS.

I gotta go 'cause I'm probably definitely gonna nod out again.

by Drugs Delaney on Jan 5, 2009 2:36 PM EST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Advantage Lowrie

a few more RBIs? More than double. More productive at bats & superior defense. Keep in mind, Lowrie did that with an injured hand, which explains his dip in production as the season wore on. I liked the Lugo signing- note the past tense.

"simul justus et peccator"

by cavman on Jan 5, 2009 2:40 PM EST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Yes, I forgot to mention the hand issue with Lowrie.

by Randy Booth on Jan 5, 2009 3:30 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

And everyone is going to bring it up.

Clutch: A measurement of how much better or worse a player does in high leverage situations than he would have done in a context neutral environment. http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/index.php/glossary/

by bs.uf15bosox9bears23 on Jan 5, 2009 6:35 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

The RBIs

Are a worthless stat to look at, although I do agree that in general Lowrie has more power and thus the higher potential to knock in runners. Lugo gets on base more though, and from I’d say we want the better guy at getting on base for our SS.

by Gnick on Jan 5, 2009 6:39 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Not a toss up in my mind

My first criteria in a SS is defense. There is no debate on who the better defensive shortstop is. There was speculation when Lowrie first started but he proved to me that he can play the postion well.

by drabidea on Jan 5, 2009 3:33 PM EST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Hey

Before Darth Vader cut off Lowrie’s hand midway through the season, he was killing the ball. Remember on Baseball Tonight, the one announcer would always say after a Lowrie highlight, “Jed Lowrie, you may never see Julio Lugo again…” I think Lowrie has this thing in the bag.

by DirtySouthSox on Jan 5, 2009 4:36 PM EST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Lowrie.

Lugo is back-up. I wonder how Lugo would do as a fourth OF….

Well, I'll appreciate for you to keep my zingers outta your mouth!

by BoSox415 on Jan 5, 2009 5:00 PM EST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I like Lugo

as our backup 3B, SS, 2B, #5OF. I think we should sign somebody to be a #4OF, 1B. With these two and Bard, all of our positions would be covered by serviceable backups (usually it takes 4 players to do so). We could then pursue another bullpen arm, a third catcher (externally or internally), or another role player / bench player.

by Schulz on Jan 5, 2009 5:45 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Assuming we get Tek?

Or do you have one of the minor leaguers on the roster for now?

Clutch: A measurement of how much better or worse a player does in high leverage situations than he would have done in a context neutral environment. http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/index.php/glossary/

by bs.uf15bosox9bears23 on Jan 5, 2009 6:36 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Yea,

I’m assuming we sign Tek. Otherwise Bard is the starter and Kottaras is the backup.

by Schulz on Jan 6, 2009 12:36 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Drab has it spot-on..

This sentence…
“a majority of Lugo’s errors came on throws to first base, not necessarily fielding ground balls.”
clinches it for me. And that’s with Youk manning first, so really how bad were those throws? We all know the importance of SS on the defensive spectrum and since its a position we have not counted on good offense from since Nomar in his heyday, I go with the better defensive player.
As 415 said, if Lugo can also do some spot work in the OF, then his value goes heaps higher. Heck, he’s fast and .355 OBP is reasonable so I’m happy to keep him around and no one will take his salary anyway.

by sydneysox on Jan 5, 2009 5:36 PM EST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

As much as I cannot stand Julio Lugo, I feel like we are stuck with his contract. I just cannot see the Sox paying Lugo’s contract for him to be a back-up. I think if Lowrie could be included into a deal to bring us a big time bat, I’d deal him away in a second. It’s not ideal, but one of the two will have to sit, and I still think in the end it will be Lowrie, so they should trade him.

by matzushocka45 on Jan 5, 2009 5:39 PM EST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Money

I hate the argument that people feel compelled to start somebody just because they make a lot of money. Consider the money gone, vanished. Once you pay somebody, they’re paid and that’s it. Now put the best team on the field- don’t let salaries make lineup decisions for you.

by Schulz on Jan 5, 2009 5:48 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Agreed

Its a sunk cost. The money is paid and gone, it should not factor into this decision. Lugo is a better than average backup. Lowrie could be an average starter at SS. I go with the young guy.

by BTLove on Jan 5, 2009 7:18 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Lowell...

is a big wildcard in this situation as well. Dr’s say he’ll be 100% by March, but If he’s not ready to go by Opening Day we’re likely to see Lowrie at the hot corner and Lugo at short for a while at least.

by TyC on Jan 5, 2009 5:41 PM EST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

All the more reason to go out and get a big bat.

by matzushocka45 on Jan 5, 2009 6:21 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

In the cubbyholes, obviously.

Clutch: A measurement of how much better or worse a player does in high leverage situations than he would have done in a context neutral environment. http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/index.php/glossary/

by bs.uf15bosox9bears23 on Jan 5, 2009 6:34 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

You've never seen Ells' BP swing, have you?

Clutch: A measurement of how much better or worse a player does in high leverage situations than he would have done in a context neutral environment. http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/index.php/glossary/

by bs.uf15bosox9bears23 on Jan 5, 2009 6:37 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

O I have and thus my fear :)

by matzushocka45 on Jan 5, 2009 6:39 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Umm... the scouts and the Red Sox management staff drool over that swing.

Clutch: A measurement of how much better or worse a player does in high leverage situations than he would have done in a context neutral environment. http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/index.php/glossary/

by bs.uf15bosox9bears23 on Jan 5, 2009 6:54 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

"Ells' BP swing"

That phrase gives me shivers. Not in a good way.

Manny ain't the only bad man.

by tommy.otm on Jan 5, 2009 7:55 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Why? You can do a lot of tinkering in BP that translates to the game.

Clutch: A measurement of how much better or worse a player does in high leverage situations than he would have done in a context neutral environment. http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/index.php/glossary/

by bs.uf15bosox9bears23 on Jan 5, 2009 9:30 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

We need him to work on not swinging at the curves near his feet first.

 And contact in general. Then he can start swinging for the fences.

Clutch: A measurement of how much better or worse a player does in high leverage situations than he would have done in a context neutral environment. http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/index.php/glossary/

by bs.uf15bosox9bears23 on Jan 6, 2009 5:22 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Bench Jacoby? I don’t think so. The guy has only had one year in the bigs. We need to give him time. If we bench him now, it’s going to kill him.

by Randy Booth on Jan 5, 2009 6:41 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Well then I hope everyone loves the idea of Holliday playing in LF for us next season…because I think thats where we are headed if we do not get a big bat this off-season.

by matzushocka45 on Jan 5, 2009 6:45 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Oh man. We’re going to have these Holliday talks all season long.

Big bat? More like an inflated bat. I’d like to see how he produces in Oakland for a half season before making any judgments on the guy. And everyone needs to remember we still have Jason Bay, who I do consider a “big bat.” He’ll be a FA at the end of the season but I think he’d be easy to re-sign.

by Randy Booth on Jan 5, 2009 6:49 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I agree, I want nothing to do with Holliday, thats my point. and if you look ahead to next off-season Bay is the next best thing to Holliday so I do not see him being easy to re-sign.

by matzushocka45 on Jan 5, 2009 6:51 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Theo won't sign him.

Clutch: A measurement of how much better or worse a player does in high leverage situations than he would have done in a context neutral environment. http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/index.php/glossary/

by bs.uf15bosox9bears23 on Jan 5, 2009 6:55 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I see it as being somewhat easy because he loves playing in Boston. He seems like the kind of guy that would take a discount.

by Randy Booth on Jan 5, 2009 7:02 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Meh, I’d like to see us get a Michael Young, Lance Berkman, Brian Mccann, Miguel Cabrera, type. It would cost us a lot, but with teams looking to shed $$ it could still be possible.

by matzushocka45 on Jan 5, 2009 7:06 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

<3 Lance Berkman & Miguel Cabrera …. unlikely, though.

by Randy Booth on Jan 5, 2009 7:17 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I think Miggy could be had.

by matzushocka45 on Jan 5, 2009 7:19 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I’m not sure. Miggy is about the only thing good on that Tigers team…

by Randy Booth on Jan 5, 2009 7:20 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I think for a package of guys they would move him. They would want the $$ off the books and need the prospects badly.

by matzushocka45 on Jan 5, 2009 7:24 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

And they just traded Joyce for EJax.

WTG, El Tigres.

Clutch: A measurement of how much better or worse a player does in high leverage situations than he would have done in a context neutral environment. http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/index.php/glossary/

by bs.uf15bosox9bears23 on Jan 5, 2009 7:33 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Not sure anyone's going to look down here again.

But even if the Tigers were to consider trading Miggy, they’d almost surely try to package Gary Sheffield as a booby bonus prize.

"Are you a real doctor, or a doctor like Dr. Pepper is a doctor?"

by Allen Chace on Jan 8, 2009 4:18 AM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Michael Young

Doesn’t belong in the conversation with those other guys. He’s declining like Jeter and well-overpaid despite the Gold Glove he somehow got.

"Are you a real doctor, or a doctor like Dr. Pepper is a doctor?"

by Allen Chace on Jan 6, 2009 12:04 AM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   1 recs

To da quire.

Clutch: A measurement of how much better or worse a player does in high leverage situations than he would have done in a context neutral environment. http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/index.php/glossary/

by bs.uf15bosox9bears23 on Jan 6, 2009 5:22 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

[I know, it's spelled choir, but it makes the joke funnier.]

Clutch: A measurement of how much better or worse a player does in high leverage situations than he would have done in a context neutral environment. http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/index.php/glossary/

by bs.uf15bosox9bears23 on Jan 6, 2009 5:23 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Michael Young

That is one of the last players I want to see the Red Sox get. As stated previously, he is a guy who is on the decline. He has little to know power and hit .284 last year. Even though he won the Gold Glove last year (which we all know has little to do with good defense), Bill James and a panel of experts didn’t even rank him in the Top 10 at his position. So if we are going to hope, I think we can do a little better than Michael Young.

by desmet on Jan 6, 2009 12:49 AM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

And Bay isn't a big bat?

Clutch: A measurement of how much better or worse a player does in high leverage situations than he would have done in a context neutral environment. http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/index.php/glossary/

by bs.uf15bosox9bears23 on Jan 5, 2009 6:55 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I guess we shall see…

by matzushocka45 on Jan 5, 2009 6:57 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Not even close to a toss up

They put up similar numbers, but Lowrie did it with a fractured hand. He would have done better if he was healthy, which tells me he is the superior choice.

by RSNexile on Jan 5, 2009 6:07 PM EST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Lowrie was injured, too.

Consider that when comparing stats.

Clutch: A measurement of how much better or worse a player does in high leverage situations than he would have done in a context neutral environment. http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/index.php/glossary/

by bs.uf15bosox9bears23 on Jan 5, 2009 6:13 PM EST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I like Lowrie

But I’m all for a ST competition. Maybe Hoolio plays like Jimmy Rollins for three weeks and we can sucker some team to give us value for him.

Manny ain't the only bad man.

by tommy.otm on Jan 5, 2009 8:03 PM EST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

It worked

For the Yankees in trading Alberto Gonzalez…

by DirtySouthSox on Jan 6, 2009 2:43 AM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Totally

The Justice Department got suckered.

Manny ain't the only bad man.

by tommy.otm on Jan 6, 2009 2:52 AM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Is that pic actual size?

It’s f’n huge.

Clutch: A measurement of how much better or worse a player does in high leverage situations than he would have done in a context neutral environment. http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/index.php/glossary/

by bs.uf15bosox9bears23 on Jan 6, 2009 5:24 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

SS Competition

Anyitme you have a competition at a position you I wouldn’t consider it a “Win-Win” situation. If you have a quarterback controversy going into spring training you generally have 2 mediocre guys fighting for a job. That’s just what you have at shortstop, although Lowrie has the potential to be an above average shortstop, he is not there right now. Right now I favor using a platoon between the 2. With Lugo seeing more time at home and Lowrie seeing more time on the road and as a late game defensive replacement.
One benefit of each player is their flexibility. Lugo’s versatility has already been previously documented and Lowrie’s ability to play 3rd allows Lowell to take some time off or perhaps start if his hip is still bothering him. I would have liked to have seen them make a play for Furcal but his health is quite a concern, especially when you have so much money invested in Lugo already.

by desmet on Jan 5, 2009 8:12 PM EST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Not necessarily two mediocre guys.

More like a mediocre vet and an unproven youngster.

Manny ain't the only bad man.

by tommy.otm on Jan 5, 2009 8:22 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Any way to take productive outs into account?

One of the things about Lowrie is that I don’t recall him hitting into a lot of double plays—but he did seem to have a rather decent number of sacrifice flies and sacrifice RBI’s. It doesn’t fit into BA or OBP, obviously, but is there a stat that would take that into account (other than RBI total)?

I suspect that when it comes down to it, it’s a matter of returning to prior form—except Lowrie’s only trying to get back to last April, while Lugo’s trying to get back to 2006.

by lone1c on Jan 5, 2009 8:57 PM EST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

A toss up?

Like toss Lugo right up and out of a window?

Thanks. I’ll be here all week.

"Are you a real doctor, or a doctor like Dr. Pepper is a doctor?"

by Allen Chace on Jan 6, 2009 1:09 AM EST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Haha

It’s good to see people who share my distaste for Julio Lugo. He is the Derek Anderson of baseball.

by DirtySouthSox on Jan 6, 2009 2:45 AM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Derek Anderson gets too much shit

He sucks, but he’s not worse than Tony Romo.

Mother---- him and John Wayne!

by MerryGoByeBye on Jan 6, 2009 3:38 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

But, does he have a contract with Starter and WalMart?

Clutch: A measurement of how much better or worse a player does in high leverage situations than he would have done in a context neutral environment. http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/index.php/glossary/

by bs.uf15bosox9bears23 on Jan 6, 2009 5:25 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I said a contract with WalMart.

Not a contact IN WalMart. Oh wait, she was in a quasi-Sam’s/Costco in that one movie, not WalMart.

Clutch: A measurement of how much better or worse a player does in high leverage situations than he would have done in a context neutral environment. http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/index.php/glossary/

by bs.uf15bosox9bears23 on Jan 6, 2009 6:35 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Eh. I actually was attempting to just make a bad joke.

Anyone who’s been around here awhile knows that I’m, not an ardent, but a semi-Lugo supporter.

"Are you a real doctor, or a doctor like Dr. Pepper is a doctor?"

by Allen Chace on Jan 7, 2009 12:16 AM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Scratch that...

He’s the Tarvaris Jackson of baseball. He is a no talent butt clown.

by DirtySouthSox on Jan 6, 2009 2:49 AM EST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Ben Grieve of SS's.

"Are you a real doctor, or a doctor like Dr. Pepper is a doctor?"

by Allen Chace on Jan 7, 2009 12:17 AM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   1 recs

Allows Lugo to be super utility backup (SS, 2B, 3B, OF)

If he has a hard time throwing from ss how could he throw from 3b? I would like to see him at SS, 2B,and OF. His speed in the OF could be a nice fit with coco gone. But he’s not going to make the plays like Coco did.

by Red Sox #1 Fan on Jan 6, 2009 5:34 PM EST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

He overthrows Youk most of the time.

Clutch: A measurement of how much better or worse a player does in high leverage situations than he would have done in a context neutral environment. http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/index.php/glossary/

by bs.uf15bosox9bears23 on Jan 6, 2009 5:39 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Exactly.

Lugo has a pretty strong arm. And I think, despite what metrics said this year, pretty good range. It’s what he does right after he gets the ball (bobbling, poor accuracy/aiming) that makes him a bad defensive SS.

"Are you a real doctor, or a doctor like Dr. Pepper is a doctor?"

by Allen Chace on Jan 7, 2009 12:11 AM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Stupidity metrics?

Clutch: A measurement of how much better or worse a player does in high leverage situations than he would have done in a context neutral environment. http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/index.php/glossary/

by bs.uf15bosox9bears23 on Jan 7, 2009 8:20 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

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