Counterpoint: It's Tek who is being "disloyal" [Promoted FanPost]
In a sense this post is an over-long answer to fishfarmr, who called Sox fans critical of Jason Varitek disloyal. I believe Tek is the one who is being disloyal.
Four years ago, he and his agent (Scott Boras) held the Sox' feet to the fire before agreeing to a 4 year/$40 million contract. Tek was coming off his best season--.296 AVG/.390 OBP/.482 SLG--and he was looking for 5 years/$55 million. Had any other team offered that, we would not be debating about Jason Varitek right now.
First off, anyone who thinks Scott Boras somehow screwed over Varitek on arbitration is crazy. Boras and Tek have worked hand in glove for years. Also, MLB players know the deal. If Tek didn't think he was still worth $10 million, he would have accepted the Sox' offer. Even if Tek was misled by Boras, it was only because Tek wanted the money. Baseball is a business--and Tek is a businessman as well as a player.
Loyalty has nothing to do with it. If it did, Tek would have signed with the Sox long ago. Instead, Tek's girlfriend, Heidi Watney, is reporting that somehow he didn't know the arbitration rules. This late change of heart by the Sox' captain seems very contrived to me. Basically, Tek found out he has little value to any team except Boston and now he wants to end his career there.
If Varitek was truly loyal, he would accept a $2 or $3 million contract to stay in Boston. That would not be a "hometown discount," it would be slightly more than he is worth.
Four years ago, the Sox gave Varitek a 4 year/$40 million contract. He only had one good season during that contract: 2005. Over the last three years of the contract, Tek hit .238 AVG/.336 OBP/.393 SLG.
Since the end of the 2005 season, Tek has been putrid at the plate. In three seasons, he has only had 7 months where his AVG was .250 or better; and 5 months with a .350 or better OBP. Last year, Kevin Cash and Tek were offensive equals. Varitek was 15th out of 21 AL catchers with 200 plate appearances in VORP. He placed just behind Salty and Gregg Zaun. Looking at MLV, Tek was even worse. (MLV is an estimate of the additional number of runs a given player will contribute to a lineup that otherwise consists of average offensive performers). Tek placed 18th out of 21 AL catchers in MLV, better than only Molina, Johjima, and Mathis.
Here is a comparison of Varitek and Gregg Zaun, who just signed a 1 year/$1.5 million contract with Baltimore.
2008 season:
Varitek - (423 AB) .220 AVG/.313 OBP/.359 SLG (22.2% of base-stealers caught).
Zaun - (245 AB) .237 AVG/.340 OBP/.359 SLG (25.9% of base-stealers caught).
2006-2008:
Varitek - (1223 AB) .238 AVG/.336 OBP/.393 SLG (22.9% CS)
Zaun - (866 AB) .251 AVG/.348 OBP/.413 SLG (20.8% CS)
Both catchers are 37-year old switch-hitters, with very similar numbers. Zaun may have been a better fit if the Sox are thinking about a catching platoon, as it appears Jason Varitek is the only person on the planet who still thinks he is a starting catcher.
I know the Boston media loves to talk about Varitek's intangibles. That's probably because his tangibles suck so badly. Sooner or later the Sox will have to cut ties to Tek. When that happens, many will panic because no one else, it seems, can handle the Sox' pitching staff. However, about 10 years ago, when Tek was learning his craft, Joe Kerrigan called the pitches from the dugout. In my opinion, John Farrell is more than capable of doing that for any of the new Sox catchers. Farrell knows the staff very well. In fact, I'd credit him far more than Tek for Beckett's post-2006 turn around and the development of the young pitchers.
Again, Gregg Zaun signed a $1.5 million contract. That's the market for Varitek. A $2 or $3 million (no incentive) contract would be extremely generous.
5 recs |
68 comments
Comments
Rec'd.
Well, I'll appreciate for you to keep my zingers outta your mouth!
by BoSox415 on Jan 19, 2009 8:12 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
I'm just overly loyal.
You have to do something really horrible before I turn against you.
For those children who claimed they’ve been a fan of their favorite team all their life, or even since they were about four or five years old: bullshit. There’s always that certain event or certain player that draws to the sport and draws you to a team. For me, Nomar Garciaparra was that reason. - Nick Coviello: I Try To See Rocco, But All I Think Is Nomar; 1/9/09
by bs.uf15bosox9bears23 on Jan 19, 2009 8:28 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
This is just business
Tek should of taken arbitration, but again someone listened to Boras who has no interest in the players best situation, only what the best money offer is available.
He let Boras dictate a deal with Teixeira which had very negative consequences for Tek, so I have little if any sympathy for him.
by SoxAcumen on Jan 19, 2009 9:36 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
You are saying...
that Tek should be mad that Boras got Tex a deal with Yankees? Thats a bit of a stretch I think. Tex did not want to play in Boston, and the MFY offered more money, kinda a no brainer for him. And yes, declining arbitration was dumb, but its not just Boras who wants the most money possible, so does Tek. It was a mistake on both of their parts.
by BTLove on Jan 20, 2009 2:34 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Furthermore
Instead, Tek’s girlfriend, Heidi Watney, is reporting that somehow he didn’t know the arbitration rules.
I read that on Extra Bases (I think), and I found it a bit odd. Seems to lack a certain ring of truthfulness, doesn’t it?
Rock me, sexy Jesus...
by nuthinboutnuthin on Jan 19, 2009 9:24 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
Sounds like she's trying to be a mole for Tek.
Did I just create a conspiracy?
For those children who claimed they’ve been a fan of their favorite team all their life, or even since they were about four or five years old: bullshit. There’s always that certain event or certain player that draws to the sport and draws you to a team. For me, Nomar Garciaparra was that reason. - Nick Coviello: I Try To See Rocco, But All I Think Is Nomar; 1/9/09
by bs.uf15bosox9bears23 on Jan 19, 2009 9:30 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
If this is true
the Girlfriend thing. Boras should be fired ASAP. Its your job as an agent to let your client know these little details. How can you make an informed decision on an offer if you have no idea how the system works.
Sorry, this is Tek’s fault and Tek’s responsibility. IF Tek was brought in on Assault charges but did not understand the law who is to blame when he turns down a deal with the DA? Tek and his lawyer should be disbarred.
by SoxAcumen on Jan 19, 2009 9:39 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Well, you figure Boras is the type of agent that just says, “Don’t worry about anything. Just sit back and I’ll take care of everything.”
by Randy Booth on Jan 19, 2009 9:43 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
sure
i believe that, but no crying if you go to jail for 3-5 instead of the 12 month probation you were offered in a plea.
by SoxAcumen on Jan 19, 2009 9:44 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Oh, I completely understand. I think you’re right, I just think that’s probably the way Boras is…
by Randy Booth on Jan 19, 2009 9:49 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
How is it possible that we all understand the arb rules but Tek does not?
I mean, he has a lot at stake here. If this is true, Tek is an absolute dolt.
by BTLove on Jan 20, 2009 2:36 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
It's possible...
That Boras’ clients are steered towards a “just trust Big Daddy Scott” posture in their relationship with him – where they just do what he asks, and trust that he’ll get them the most money. Even still, it seems highly incongruous that a man who prepares for opposing hitter’s tendencies as methodically as Varitek is widely supposed to would be so absolutely unprepared for his impending free agency.
In many ways, its more incomprehensible than Donovan McNabb not knowing the overtime rules for a tie in the NFL. At least Tek had been through free agency before…
Rock me, sexy Jesus...
by nuthinboutnuthin on Jan 20, 2009 4:03 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Yeah.
I mean there is only one tie in the NFL every 5 or so years. Teams get compensatory draft picks 20 or so times every season. You would think that a guy would take a little responsibility for his own future and spend ten minutes reading the CBA.
by BTLove on Jan 20, 2009 7:02 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
There was a case in 2007 where a Boras client blamed him for not letting him know that he was subject to a fourth option year. Admittedly the 4th option year rule is a bit more arcane than the Type A ranking….
by morineko on Jan 21, 2009 10:37 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Ahem
015, your mission: www.firescottboras.com . © is yours.
Well, I'll appreciate for you to keep my zingers outta your mouth!
by BoSox415 on Jan 23, 2009 8:18 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I actually kinda like Boras.
He’s a bigger-than-life figure, and prone to wild exaggeration. Sorta like me. Also, it’s not like he marches his clients around at gun-point and forces them to do awful things to teams. And it’s not like the other people in baseball (owners, GMs) are paragons of virtue either. Except for St. Henry and St. Epstein, many of them are driven to make hard deals.
"It's just a tiny little nick, but it hurts when I get champagne in there."
- Jason Bay, on getting spiked scoring the winning run in ALDS Game Four.
by 0157H7 on Jan 24, 2009 12:15 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
It would be like FJM though.
Not specifically about him, but sports management in general.
For those children who claimed they’ve been a fan of their favorite team all their life, or even since they were about four or five years old: bullshit. There’s always that certain event or certain player that draws to the sport and draws you to a team. For me, Nomar Garciaparra was that reason. - Nick Coviello: I Try To See Rocco, But All I Think Is Nomar; 1/9/09
by bs.uf15bosox9bears23 on Jan 24, 2009 7:59 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Lets not forget that ec=very player is required to go to meeting about
arbitration, salary structure, changes or amendments in the CBA, etc every year during ST with their team player rep. Free agent compensation is covered at every one of those meetings.
For Tek to say that means that he is either to lazy to pay attention in the meetings or lying through his teeth.
by laxtonto on Jan 20, 2009 3:47 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Who is the Sox’ player rep, anyway?
(LOL if it’s Varitek. I had thought it was Papelbon, which also, um, may explain things?)
by morineko on Jan 21, 2009 10:36 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Last I heard it was Youkilis.
by walkoff baltimore chop on Jan 22, 2009 4:05 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
This is the vitriol I speak of.
His numbers are garbage no doubt. I completely want Teagarden, But the way we are treating this guy is wrong. My 20 mil was for point not that I actually think he should get it. A two year deal with a lot of incentives is the way it should go if at all. I agree with Farrell handling the staff too, but " girlfriend Heidi Watney?" . Come on, spreading that garbage is exactly what I was getting at. Your statistical analysis is good, your personal angles sound like a Yankee fan. You are better than that, I know, I read your stuff all the time.
the difference between a yankee stadium hot dog and a Fenway frank is that they dont sell yankee dogs in October anymore.
by fishfarmr on Jan 19, 2009 9:36 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
Its just business
Are you saying that after the Red Sox offered arbitration and was turned down, they should offer arbitration-type money, not what the catcher market currently dictates, just because we like him as a person?
Sorry, nothing against Tek, but even offering him arbitration and another 2 million a year contract is incredibly generous of the Red Sox. He has NO value on the market.
Let me ask you this hypo…IF the Red Sox gave up their right to a draft pick compensation if another team signed Tek, do you believe Tek would re-sign with the Red Sox?
I do not. Boras would run him to the highest bidder in a week.
by SoxAcumen on Jan 19, 2009 9:43 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Of course
If the pick was gone he would get 4-5 mil a year for 2 years from a couple of teams. I don’t really disagree with anything statistical, nor the fact that I feel we need to move on. I am just saying that we as a fan base have turned on this guy and I always thought we were better than those New York fans. I am not a Varitek guy, I just don’t like the tone of things. Especially since he is the captain and long time sox. There is a way to say goodbye and thanks with class, we have somehow missed that memo.
the difference between a yankee stadium hot dog and a Fenway frank is that they dont sell yankee dogs in October anymore.
by fishfarmr on Jan 19, 2009 9:51 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Well, valid points
but i still like him, I wish he would take a position on Terry F.’s staff and help the Red Sox coaching young kids in the Red Sox system.
by SoxAcumen on Jan 19, 2009 9:52 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Drugs just laid out the stats.
Varitek has been a poor hitter the last few years (although his 2007 was ok); Drugs pointed that out, no issues there. And everyone knows about the Heidi Watney thing, its fine. So what we all are trying to focus on is what the Sox ought to do to be the best team possible in 2009. The reason we won the WS in 2007 was because we fucked sentimentality and let most of the team walk. Most of those moves have looked great in retrospect. My guess is that in 2005 you were wishing we gave Pedro a deal and kept Millar around and so on. We have to look ahead.
by BTLove on Jan 20, 2009 2:41 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
How are the Sox treating Tek badly?
He was awful for 3 years—and they offered him a chance to make at least $10 million in 2009. Tek turned it down.
Tek and Whatney have been an item since last season. She is hardly a good source.
I have no “personal angles.” In my opinion, $3 million—twice what Zaun got—would be a very generous offer.
I gotta go 'cause I'm probably definitely gonna nod out again.
by Drugs Delaney on Jan 19, 2009 9:49 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Not all bad,
as I said above, Tek actually had a good 2007 season. His OPS+ was 103, which is really valuable for a catcher. He was about three wins above replacement that year (which is worth like $12 mil in FA). Even last year when he was horrid, he was still above a full win above replacement, which is worth $4mil, and that does not account for his ability to handle the staff. Thats probably worth another win or so.
by BTLove on Jan 20, 2009 2:45 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Look at the splits
for 2007. As I recall, he stunk in the second half of 2007. Similar to 2008 (but not as dramatic). Even in this “good” year he blew after June.
by Buzzy on Jan 20, 2009 7:51 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Not really...
his OPS+ by months in 2007: 88, 155, 91, 105, 94, 118. So he had a great May and September, and wasn’t terrible in any single month.
by BTLove on Jan 20, 2009 7:06 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
To be more precise
He had an extremely lucky May, and a good September. Look at his BAPIP in May and July-he just got lucky. On the other hand, while he hit below 230 in September he slugged well and walked, so his BAPIP was reasonable and he still put up a good OPS+. Overall, he hit below 230 in the second half, when his BAPIP was in line with what it should be (around 290/300). If you take out his May and July, the season does not make a good case for a strong hitting year. Certainly a reasonable one that was better than this year, but not so good.
by Buzzy on Jan 20, 2009 7:59 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
His 2007 BABIP was about in line with his career average.
His career BABIP is .309 and it was .313 in 2007. So if you take out the months that are 30 points lucky you should also take out those that are unlucky. Really, by most measures Varitek was one of the 6 or 7 best catchers in the league.
by BTLove on Jan 20, 2009 9:05 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Yeah
an average BAPIP is 300, and less for a player with diminished skills and speed. You can’t really call any of the other months unlucky except maybe April. As a player gets worse his line drive rate decreases, he beats out less plays at 1st, etc. That is why you cant compare a 35 year old catcher with his average year. Now, in 2007 his month by month BAPIPs were 275, 339, 313, 365, 294, 282. The outliers are lucky ones, and there is not an obvious unlucky one (just look at the variance).
by Buzzy on Jan 20, 2009 9:24 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Us, not the Sox
Again, I don’t really disagree with anything statistical, nor the fact that I feel we need to move on. I am just saying that we as a fan base have turned on this guy and I always thought we were better than those New York fans. I am not a Varitek guy, I just don’t like the tone of things. Especially since he is the captain and long time sox. There is a way to say goodbye and thanks with class, we have somehow missed that memo.
the difference between a yankee stadium hot dog and a Fenway frank is that they dont sell yankee dogs in October anymore.
by fishfarmr on Jan 19, 2009 9:53 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
Does anyone have EVIDENCE that Tek and Watney are dating?
I can’t find any online, just rumors / speculation. Which, on the internet, means less than nothing. Barring hard evidence, it’s just as likely that she’s after a “former Sox groundskeeper.”
Unless evidence can be furnished, we should assume that there is no relationship between the named personalities. My relationship with Salma Hayek, on the other hand…
"It's just a tiny little nick, but it hurts when I get champagne in there."
- Jason Bay, on getting spiked scoring the winning run in ALDS Game Four.
by 0157H7 on Jan 19, 2009 9:59 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
She was my safety S/O.
My first choice was a female Sox groundskeeper. Love that dirty…
"It's just a tiny little nick, but it hurts when I get champagne in there."
- Jason Bay, on getting spiked scoring the winning run in ALDS Game Four.
by 0157H7 on Jan 19, 2009 11:20 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I just wanted to comment...
On how it’s become like a common thing on OTM for guys to fall in love with my sloppy seconds. I don’t know what that’s about. But, enjoy the game tonight.
by A2004LoveAffair on Jan 20, 2009 10:17 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Allen gets Salma.
And is possibly permanently done with Jager. (the liquor, not some woman I just made up.)
"Are you a real doctor, or a doctor like Dr. Pepper is a doctor?"
by Allen Chace on Jan 20, 2009 4:50 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Hey!
Salma is mine!
The rhythm is the bass and the bass is the treble
by DirtySouthSox on Jan 20, 2009 2:30 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
You guys are all dillusional
She’s sitting on my lap right now…
Mother---- him and John Wayne!
by MerryGoByeBye on Jan 20, 2009 3:09 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
This is the most
nerds-in-their-mother’s-basements thread I have ever read. EVER.
"no1 has time to read your long comments, are you writing a book?"
by britsoxfan on Jan 20, 2009 3:10 PM EST up reply actions 2 recs
+1
I was about to say the same thing.
Well, I'll appreciate for you to keep my zingers outta your mouth!
by BoSox415 on Jan 20, 2009 4:01 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I'm sure if we looked we could find worse.
Not sure I want to read that thread though…
For those children who claimed they’ve been a fan of their favorite team all their life, or even since they were about four or five years old: bullshit. There’s always that certain event or certain player that draws to the sport and draws you to a team. For me, Nomar Garciaparra was that reason. - Nick Coviello: I Try To See Rocco, But All I Think Is Nomar; 1/9/09
by bs.uf15bosox9bears23 on Jan 20, 2009 4:22 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Aww
I see a Salma Hayek link, and it’s Wikipedia. Come on, man.
Well, I'll appreciate for you to keep my zingers outta your mouth!
by BoSox415 on Jan 20, 2009 8:55 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Not a flattering pic in the preview popup on my screen either. I'd suggest this:
For those children who claimed they’ve been a fan of their favorite team all their life, or even since they were about four or five years old: bullshit. There’s always that certain event or certain player that draws to the sport and draws you to a team. For me, Nomar Garciaparra was that reason. - Nick Coviello: I Try To See Rocco, But All I Think Is Nomar; 1/9/09
by bs.uf15bosox9bears23 on Jan 20, 2009 9:09 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Getting warmer....
Well, I'll appreciate for you to keep my zingers outta your mouth!
by BoSox415 on Jan 21, 2009 8:31 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Nice one, man
I think that after Varitek turned down the arb offer, he shouldn’t have been offered a contract, period. Unless he’d play for 1,5 million or so, which I somehow doubt.
Mother---- him and John Wayne!
by MerryGoByeBye on Jan 19, 2009 10:36 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
He needs to fire Scott Boras to save himself an embarrassment but don’t give him any more $$$, Theo. Just take a good look at his stats. He couldn’t catch Wakefield. It’s time for Saltalamacchia. He is probably the most dangerous 9th hitter in the league.
by GreenGrizz on Jan 19, 2009 11:38 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
Okay, once again:
He chose not to catch Wake once he became the starter. It would have taken a toll on his body that would have limited his starts and effectiveness. He had caught Wake when he was the backup before the turn of the century.
For those children who claimed they’ve been a fan of their favorite team all their life, or even since they were about four or five years old: bullshit. There’s always that certain event or certain player that draws to the sport and draws you to a team. For me, Nomar Garciaparra was that reason. - Nick Coviello: I Try To See Rocco, But All I Think Is Nomar; 1/9/09
by bs.uf15bosox9bears23 on Jan 20, 2009 4:24 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
fishfarmr, loyalty is a 2-way street. Why should we remain devotedly loyal to him when he’s already broken loyalty? As other’s have mentioned, we already rewarded him with extra last contract, how many times do you keep giving him extra when he just keeps asking for more? He’s never taken a hometown discount and we’ve given him a contract more then he was worth once, so by my count he still owes us one if you want to go down the “loyalty” road. We offered arbitrations, he’s the one who turned them down.
Also, being able to jab and joke about our players is what separate us from Yank fans, not make us like them, who have a god complex towards their favorites like Jeter
by Realistic on Jan 20, 2009 10:21 AM EST reply actions 0 recs
If you are expecting something back from the person, I don't think that you are being very loyal in your actions.
For those children who claimed they’ve been a fan of their favorite team all their life, or even since they were about four or five years old: bullshit. There’s always that certain event or certain player that draws to the sport and draws you to a team. For me, Nomar Garciaparra was that reason. - Nick Coviello: I Try To See Rocco, But All I Think Is Nomar; 1/9/09
by bs.uf15bosox9bears23 on Jan 20, 2009 4:26 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
seriously, the sox shouldnt have to break the bank for this guy. His offensive production has been sagging more and more. Sure id like to see him finish his career here but the truth is a rookie will probably put up at least as good offensive numbers. I hear the problem is that tek wants more than 1 year. I say give him 2 years at 3 million a year. Thats very generous and showing that this guy means somthing special to this team(even when he cant hit). If he wants 3-4 years for a contract totalling near 20 million, then we really need to let him walk.
by spinz on Jan 20, 2009 3:19 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
You realize the $10mil we offered him as a possible arb result would have been like the amount of money you spend on a new movie?
Not exactly breaking the bank, even in rough economic times.
Your contract offer makes sense though. Maybe have an opt-out for either party after the first year.
For those children who claimed they’ve been a fan of their favorite team all their life, or even since they were about four or five years old: bullshit. There’s always that certain event or certain player that draws to the sport and draws you to a team. For me, Nomar Garciaparra was that reason. - Nick Coviello: I Try To See Rocco, But All I Think Is Nomar; 1/9/09
by bs.uf15bosox9bears23 on Jan 20, 2009 4:28 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Knowing a fact and understanding its implications are different
I suspect that if you asked Jason Varitek what arbitration meant he would talk about the money process (as would most informed ball players). If you asked him what happens if you decline an arbitration number and sign with another team, the discussion would still be about money, having to move on and missing friends. If you asked him if his new TEAM had to give up a draft pick if they signed him, he would pause, think a moment and then agree. The TEAM implications of his free agency would not be close to top of mind. I would also remind people that The Red Sox have led a resurgence in the idea of developing your own talent and valuing draft picks highly. Not long ago the Red Sox (pre the current administration) signed big money guys and gave away those draft picks. Boras (the self proclaimed smartest guy in the room) absolutely should have understood this. I am left wondering if he both knew, and truly appreciated the implications. My reason for wondering is that the current situation with Tek is bad for business. While I think Boras would screw a player in a New York minute, he doesn’t try to hurt his own business. The one thing I know for certain: Every agent has watched this play out, and this particular mistake won’t be repeated because agents will remember the pick and correctly gauge its value.
by Silverlock on Jan 20, 2009 8:52 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
I hope Tek just dumps Boras and cleans his hands of this.
And then begs us to forgive him.
For those children who claimed they’ve been a fan of their favorite team all their life, or even since they were about four or five years old: bullshit. There’s always that certain event or certain player that draws to the sport and draws you to a team. For me, Nomar Garciaparra was that reason. - Nick Coviello: I Try To See Rocco, But All I Think Is Nomar; 1/9/09
by bs.uf15bosox9bears23 on Jan 20, 2009 9:11 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Obviously, they didn’t understand the reaction the market would have to Varitek’s situation. As you said this was a lack of understanding the ramifications of a rule. However, Watney was reporting that Varitek did not know that rule. Boras made a miscalculation that will cost Varitek a lot of money. Too bad for them.
by BTLove on Jan 20, 2009 9:22 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Is it possible that a team would be willing to give up a draft pick if they knew that the economy wouldn't get better before they could sign their draft pick?
Maybe they are keeping the pick as a piece that has inflated value now b/c it involves financial transactions in a possibly better environment.
For those children who claimed they’ve been a fan of their favorite team all their life, or even since they were about four or five years old: bullshit. There’s always that certain event or certain player that draws to the sport and draws you to a team. For me, Nomar Garciaparra was that reason. - Nick Coviello: I Try To See Rocco, But All I Think Is Nomar; 1/9/09
by bs.uf15bosox9bears23 on Jan 20, 2009 9:47 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
That is probably spin
While I consider it possible for players to have the tunnel vision to not know, I don’t think it is likely in Tek’s case. Even if my above assessment is correct, it would hardly make a good soundbite. Also, Tek is unlikely to admit that what he didn’t understand is the impact that a pick would have on his value. That would make him seem calculating and and very agent like.
by Silverlock on Jan 21, 2009 7:35 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
The difference is that this is a risky move (assuming Boras knew all the implications which as an agent he should) that works sometimes and fails others, and Boras would never hurt his own business, but he would definitely take on a risk that has a “some you win some you lose” if the times he wins outweigh the times he loses, not being a people who cares that the ones he lose hurt those players (as in, he doesn’t mind that he is screwing over one of his players he represents if it means some other player(s) he represents may have better outcomes by the same strategy)
by Realistic on Jan 21, 2009 9:57 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
If he gained the reputation for not caring about hurting the players he represents, then he would lose clients. I guarantee he does everything he can do achieve his clients’ objectives.
by BTLove on Jan 21, 2009 10:51 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
What, you mean like when A-Rod dropped him, or when Kenny Rodgers fired him (because he stated he only wanted to play for the Tigers but Boras wanted to shop him elsewhere because he thought he could get more money elsewhere, a perfect example of Boras ingoring the player’s interest in favor of his own), or when Zambrano fired him, or when Corey Patterson fired him, or Guthrie, or Gary Sheffield (who ranted on about how bad Boras was for a while), or John Danks, want me to keep going?
by Realistic on Jan 22, 2009 12:05 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
but guys keep coming back for more. Manny dumped his agent for Boras. Also, A-Rod did not drop him, Boras is still collecting checks on the $30 mil per contract. And look at those other guys; they are some of the most rogue-ish guys in the league. I really don’t think many players look to what Gary Sheffield and Kenny Roders do as blue prints for success.
My point is that Boras’s recipe for success is to keep clients happy. He does this by getting them more money than any other agent would. This is why he is the most successful agent in sports. If he were just some jackass, none of us would even know who he is.
by BTLove on Jan 22, 2009 2:31 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
He's not just *some* jackass
He’s the big-daddy, grand poobah of jackasses.
"You know you're having a bad day when the fifth inning rolls around and they drag the warning track." - Mike Flanagan, Baltimore Orioles pitcher, 1992.
by SoxDevil on Jan 23, 2009 12:01 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Not true, I’ll agree that he gets the big money, and that is the sole reason people keep going back to him, not because they for one sec believe that he cares about their wishes. It’s the same reason that musicians keep signing with big labels like Geffen, sure they don’t care much about the artist wishes, often make them sell out, make them change things in their music, and give them next to nothing on % of sales, but that’s where the money is at. Same with Boras, we have hard fact of him going against his player’s wishes (Rogue or not, Rogers said he wanted to stay in Detroit, and Boras blantantly ignored him and tried to get other teams to sign him, Damon as much as we all might hate him said all things even, he would prefer the Sox, Boras wanted him to go to NY so he never gave the sox a chance to counter the Yanks offer, or a lesser know Pedro Alvarez, who was happy with the draft signing the Pirates gave him and just wanted to play, but in an effort to squeeze more money from the Pirates Boras filed a grievance that may result in Alvarez not being able to play for a whole another year, or the very subject of the post, Varitek, who wanted to enter minor leagues his Junior year, but Boras insistence of a hold out forced him not only to wait until his senior year, but Boras held out yet again and Varitek had to wait until the dispute was over, resulting in losing 2 years of his would been career). People put up with him because he has gotten the big contracts, but putting up with him is not the same as believing that he has their best interest at heart, because we know that he cares most about himself, and facts such as the ones above where he put his own interest above his clients
by Realistic on Jan 23, 2009 3:57 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Well fine.
Then the guys who “put up with him” actually want the big contracts too. Their wishes are for the most money. Why would Tek stay with him all of these years after he lost him two years of his career (when he was probably just slaying at GTech)?I know he’s sketch, but so are the GM’s. Its a tough business, and Boras just plays a little tougher than the other guys.
by BTLove on Jan 24, 2009 1:27 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs

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