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PAPI TRADE! Big Papi Still Your Daddy?

 RED SOX ULTRAS 1901 Speaking....

When Papi forever added the word "Big" to his name during the 2004 playoff campaign with his daily walk-off heroics, he reached the a new level not only as a professional baseball player but, of even greater significance, he reached a new level in the hearts and minds of the Red Sox faithful.

Not an easy accomplishment, considering the fact that, as fans go, back in those bad 'ol days before two World Series trophies found their way into Boston, we could have been considered a pretty conservative bunch: few players came to Boston and earned a Hall Pass to Red Sox Grace with ease. For us it was always harping on the historic--Young, Ted, Yaz, Boggs, Foxx. Pedro had to work for his share of fame and so did Nomar.

Yet Ortiz came from Minnesota a virtual nobody, and in just the space of 24 months, two years spanning two eras in Red Sox history, one might say, he became a phenom amongst Red Sox fans, a player whose jersey's sold like hot-cakes and whose name became a sort of mantra for Sox fans. Combine his 2004 success with his record breaking 2006 season and then another title in 2007 with countess late-game heroics in between, and it seems as if David Ortiz, from the perspective of Red Sox fans, could do nothing wrong.

Yet this seems to be the season of reversals. It's mid-September and the Red Sox are chasing the Tampa Bay Devil Rays for the coveted AL East crown, those Bastard Yankees are rotting in 4th (and hopefully 5th?) place and woe-and-behold, our Big Papi has been very quiet since Day 1 of 2008.

So I ask the question, loyal and loving fans as we are we can be tough as nails: our priority is and always has been the RED SOX, and in our history no player however good at one time or other in his career has reached a status above that of the team as a whole. Big Papi, however great, has failed to produce much this season--and the Boston Red Sox seem to be doing fine without him anyway. The media, as well as Sox Nation in general, seems to have become very silent on this arch-headline stealer, Ortiz. Pedroia, Bay, Beckett, Lester these appear to be the new names on the hot plate, possibly affirming that the "old" team of '04 (Ortiz-Pedro-Schilling-Manny) is gone. In deed of the four players mentioned, only one remains: DAVID "BIG PAPI" ORTIZ  Does the lovable but recently unproductive Papi still deserve to have his name on that hotplate? Dare I ask the question: Is it time Papi hits the road? How would you react if Papi were traded?

0 recs  |  Comment 25 comments

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I wouldn't be upset

If we got a valuable guy in return in trade. I cannot remember the last time Big Papi hit a walkoff home run. People are still living off his memories from four years ago. That’s not to say, however, that he doesn’t still have great value for his presence alone.

 Tito and Theo would be able to tell you exactly how valuable (or not) he is, at this point. I’ll trust in their judgment on this one.

by ccthemovieman on Sep 9, 2008 6:39 PM EDT reply actions   1 recs

Memories yet still recent ones...

I agree that many people are still living of 2004 David Ortiz memories, something I can be guilty of (I still guiltily find myself watching the 2004 ALCS Red Sox-Wankees Game 5 14th inning walk-off from time to time), however let’s not forget that Ortiz has had excellent seasons in 2005, 2006 and 2007, including a string of walk-offs and another WS Title. 2004 might be a long time ago, but the perfume on 2007 is still mildly sweet. Maybe you’re right and Ortiz is nothing more but an out-dated icon. Then again, maybe Red Sox Nation needs this icon.

by RedSoxUltras on Sep 9, 2008 6:47 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Papi isn't in vs. Kazmir tonight...

The fact that he was out for a third of the season, roughly, might have factored into the lack of BIG production. He has still been a great player this season, and his presence in the clubhouse is irreplaceable.

Remember when we were kids and we mixed sodas together and called them "suicides"? It was OK though, because Dr. Pepper was always there.

by bs.uf15bosox9bears23 on Sep 9, 2008 7:37 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

And

when he has been in, he has been battling a slew of injuries. But he still has an OPS+ of 123, which ain’t too shabby.

Morever, it’s not like he hasn’t done anything in four years. Last year, his OPS+ was 171, as compared to 145 in 2004.

I’d be shocked if we traded Papi. He’s under contract for two more years at @ $13m, which is pretty good value if he approaches his 2003-07 levels. And I think he will.

Manny ain't the only bad man.

by tommy.otm on Sep 9, 2008 8:01 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Can we trade Big Paps instead?

Remember when we were kids and we mixed sodas together and called them "suicides"? It was OK though, because Dr. Pepper was always there.

by bs.uf15bosox9bears23 on Sep 10, 2008 6:08 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

I'll Take Paps Anytime,

HOWEVER, back on the subject of Big PAPI, personally, I think he’s going to emerge in the postseason (provided we make it)…in fact, should David Ortiz fail to produce in the post season (provided we make it), I reckon his emotional hold on the team will loosen quite a bit. If we make the post season, will David Ortiz have to step it up a notch to avoid the trade block?

by RedSoxUltras on Sep 10, 2008 7:21 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

No I don't think so

Theo is very good at not selling low on players. Papi’s stock is about as low as it has ever been (since he has been with Sox of course). Theo knows that we would not get enough for him. I also think the fellow players in the dugout know that he has/is going through alot this year with injuries. If he does not produce miracles this postseason he will still be in most minds the most clutch hitter in the game.

by drabidea on Sep 11, 2008 9:07 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

I think it’s remarkable that Papi is hitting as well as he is with a wrist injury. Give him a chance to heal or have the injury repaired and he’ll be back to his normal, tater-mashing self.

"You know you're having a bad day when the fifth inning rolls around and they drag the warning track." - Mike Flanagan, Baltimore Orioles pitcher, 1992.

by SoxDevil on Sep 11, 2008 12:45 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Provided we make it?

http://www.baseballprospectus.com/statistics/ps_odds.php

There is no f’n way we don’t make it.

Remember when we were kids and we mixed sodas together and called them "suicides"? It was OK though, because Dr. Pepper was always there.

by bs.uf15bosox9bears23 on Sep 11, 2008 5:08 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

It Reminds of the Yankees

My friend I’m sure your just as devout a Sox fan as I am (or maybe you’re a Yankee impostor but there’s no way i can prove that), but let us as Red Sox fans not forget that only a few years, if we were in the position we are know, we would have been biting our nails and sitting on the edge of our seats, because we are the perennial fans of a team that has (or had) the habit of blowing it all in an amazingly fast period of time. I know, I know, you’re going to tell me that’s all in the past and the new Red Sox are the old Yankees, BUT that’s exactly what I dissent from. Wasn’t it Yankee fans whose intolerant arrogance we despised for so long? Didn’t non-Yankee fans sympathize with us cause we were humble? Common, you know they did. And I feel, that just because we have two (hard earned) World Series under our belts, that doesn’t give us the right to adopt this “Can’t catch us” attitude, not because we really are still the underdogs (we’re not) but because I believe we can be PROUD TO BE RED SOX FANS, the fans who ALWAYS DOUBT!

Forever Red Sox, screw all those pink-hatted babes, 'got no family, 'got no friends, 'got no life--RED SOX I LIVE FOR THIS.

by RedSoxUltras on Sep 11, 2008 5:39 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Do you understand the numbers I linked to?

98.28848% chance of making it to the playoffs. I’m not gonna run the numbers, but I’m pretty sure that means, barring us losing almost every game remaining, we are in.

And I hate the MFY, but I we have to root for them this weekend against the Rays. Then we can go back to calling them pigs for yelling at a pregnant woman for a comment that was taken out of context, and was made by her husband, not her.

Remember when we were kids and we mixed sodas together and called them "suicides"? It was OK though, because Dr. Pepper was always there.

by bs.uf15bosox9bears23 on Sep 11, 2008 5:48 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Wait a sec

God, Please don’t tell me “They yelled at Sarah Palin’s daughter” cause I’ve had just about enough of hearing that fucking name from just about every source available, especially REd Sox blogs. Politics out of sports!

Forever Red Sox, screw all those pink-hatted babes, 'got no family, 'got no friends, 'got no life--RED SOX I LIVE FOR THIS.

by RedSoxUltras on Sep 11, 2008 5:55 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

word.

no politics.

Manny ain't the only bad man.

by tommy.otm on Sep 11, 2008 8:04 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Thanks. I agree.

Forever Red Sox, screw all those pink-hatted babes, 'got no family, 'got no friends, 'got no life--RED SOX I LIVE FOR THIS.

by RedSoxUltras on Sep 11, 2008 8:59 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

She ain't married, from what I remember.

Paps’ wife is who I was talking about, btw.

Remember when we were kids and we mixed sodas together and called them "suicides"? It was OK though, because Dr. Pepper was always there.

by bs.uf15bosox9bears23 on Sep 12, 2008 8:10 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Yeah I Get The Numbers

But I was was talking more about Red Sox sprit than math. What pregnant woman did the Wankee fans yell at btw?

Forever Red Sox, screw all those pink-hatted babes, 'got no family, 'got no friends, 'got no life--RED SOX I LIVE FOR THIS.

by RedSoxUltras on Sep 11, 2008 5:54 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

About Those Wankee Fans at the Allstar Game

I don’t want to diverge from the theme of this post, so I wont offer any commentary as far as the incident involving Yankee fans at the 2008 All Star Game is concerned, but thank you for linking me the article.

Forever Red Sox, screw all those pink-hatted babes, 'got no family, 'got no friends, 'got no life--RED SOX I LIVE FOR THIS.

by RedSoxUltras on Sep 11, 2008 9:01 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

BACK TO DAVID ORTIZ, AND (DON'T GROAN) MANNY TOO

Sorry for the divergence above. Returning to the theme at hand, I’d like to explore the question of whether or not Ortiz can still compete on the Red Sox lineup in greater depth—back in the good old days the heart of the Red Sox lineup consisted of just two words: Ortiz-Manny or Manny-Ortiz. This lethal combo made our lineup one of the most potent in all of baseball and there could not have been a better sense of security for Red Sox fans when it was a close game, the bottom of the ninth, and we heard the familiar line…“Coming up, Manny Ramirez followed by David Ortiz.”

Let’s face, it Ortiz and Manny, for the most part, got along: both power hitters, both Dominican (yes, common heritage does help lubricate those stiff social joints), both veterans, and both in possession of a unique aura that made opposing relievers shiver in their boots. Is Manny leaving the Sox (and his long history of increasing problems with the Front Office) and David Ortiz’s poor season a mere coincidence? Can Ortiz be as affective a hitter as he used to be without Manny hitting just before or just after him? How much do YOU think the Manny Trade affected Ortiz’s offensive potential?

Forever Red Sox, screw all those pink-hatted babes, 'got no family, 'got no friends, 'got no life--RED SOX I LIVE FOR THIS.

by RedSoxUltras on Sep 11, 2008 9:12 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

Slumping = panic?

Calm down. As long as Bay doesn’t follow his example and K in a critical situation again, we’re find.

Remember when we were kids and we mixed sodas together and called them "suicides"? It was OK though, because Dr. Pepper was always there.

by bs.uf15bosox9bears23 on Sep 12, 2008 8:13 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

How can an Ultras stay calm?

Hey I live, breath and sleep Red Sox, and you expect me to stay calm when I feel the entire Red Sox world coming down upon me and the strong desire to throw myself offa bridge to make the pain go away? (kidding by the way). Well Bay’s been producing lately (not during that 14 inning debacle against the Rays though) :( but the Ortiz-Bay “ticket” (siince we’re all into elections now) doesn’t sound as good as the “Ortiz-Manny” ticket. And seriously, even if Bay ends up being great, will he help “complete” Ortiz the way Many did? Number three and four or four and five hitters gotta at least act like best chums if they’re going to look menacing. Can Ortiz look menacing with Bay hitting just infront or behind him?

Forever Red Sox, screw all those pink-hatted babes, 'got no family, 'got no friends, 'got no life--RED SOX I LIVE FOR THIS.

by RedSoxUltras on Sep 12, 2008 10:24 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Don't go all Vince Young on us.

Remember when we were kids and we mixed sodas together and called them "suicides"? It was OK though, because Dr. Pepper was always there.

by bs.uf15bosox9bears23 on Sep 12, 2008 10:32 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Pressure Me Some More And I'll Go All MIchael Vick On Your Dog!

Assuming you have one. :P Compliments for the great joke bs.uef15bosox9bears (couldn’t you pick a simpler name for Chrissake? :D) Cracked me up.

Forever Red Sox, screw all those pink-hatted babes, 'got no family, 'got no friends, 'got no life--RED SOX I LIVE FOR THIS.

by RedSoxUltras on Sep 12, 2008 10:37 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Don't do that! He's just a little puppy:


My name is:
Initials . Univ. of Florida – Tebow Red Sox – Teddy Ballgame Chicago Bears – Hester

Remember when we were kids and we mixed sodas together and called them "suicides"? It was OK though, because Dr. Pepper was always there.

by bs.uf15bosox9bears23 on Sep 12, 2008 10:51 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Just plain stupid

to trade Papi. No way no how. Is this how you treat all your best players or only the ones that are the most productive. Sure he has slipped a bit and sure he will not ever be the player he once was but come on he is still better then most and I don’t see a ready replacement. Foolishness.

Baseball is God's sport! All Truth Goes Through Three Stages 1.It is ridiculed 2.It is violently opposed 3.Finally, it is accepted as self-evident. kinesiologist

by E5 on Sep 13, 2008 12:09 AM EDT reply actions   0 recs

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