The Rotation.

by Allen Chace on Jun 17, 2008 12:22 PM EDT in Open Thread

Who's safe? Who's not?

Daisuke threw a rehab start for Pawtucket, and pitched well. 5 IP, 2 ER, 4 baserunners and 5 Ks. He has proclaimed himself ready to rejoin the rotation, and as pointed out by Buster Olney last night on BBTN, is on the same schedule now as Bartolo Colon, who left the game last night with back spasms.

Believe it or not, Colon's injury might actually be a little lucky for us. No? I'll be pompous for the moment and explain.

We have three starters who are not going to be displaced in the rotation anytime soon. Jon Lester, Josh Beckett, and Tim Wakefield are not going anywhere. Amidst all of that, tonight's starter, Justin Masterson, has pitched well, with a 1.06 WHIP and a 7.84 K/9. Would like to see him lower his walks, because the hit-rate of ~5.2 H/9 isn't sustainable. Nonetheless, he's given the Sox no reason (other than having options left) to kick him out of the rotation. Are there any OTMers, for example, who would like to see him sent back to AAA later this week?

However, the smart money was that Daisuke would come back and pitch in Masterson's slot, despite pitching on Colon's schedule. After all, while he hasn't been Cy-quality, Colon has pitched well enough for us, and certainly deserved another start or two to prove he wasn't a semi long-term option. Now, however, the back spasms. I anticipate this means that we might DL Colon for Daisuke in the next several days, which would allow us to keep Colon, as otherwise he might've had to be DFA'd. (I don't believe Colon has options left, and he's not really a good bullpen candidate at this point in his career)

In this case, we can now continue to keep Colon around as insurance, and when either ineffectiveness or growing concerns about inning totals start to make us more cautious about Masterson, Colon could be ready to step back into the rotation. And if Daisuke pitches a couple starts and doesn't really look ready, we can make an adjustment that way as well.

So, the next couple weeks: Becks, Lester, Wakefield, Daisuke, and Masterson

Then, potentially, Becks, Lester, Wakefield, Daisuke, and Colon again. Either way, depth is looking good for the moment, and we've got some pieces to play around with. Not to mention a couple guys on the farm that go by the names of Buchholz and Bowden.

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Are there any OTMers who would like to see him sent back to AAA later this week?

I do. I mean, not later this week, but when we have Dice-K back and if Buch starts to dominate again in AAA. And I don’t wanna leave him there, but rather to work on his way to being a reliever and come back as such. I don’t think Masterson will be a starter, but I think he’ll be our setup man or something like that. He only has 2 pitches really, and they’re both awesome. He also gets a lot of groundballs, so I think he might work better coming from the bullpen.

It's the same old story. Boy finds girl, boy loses girl, girl finds boy, boy forgets girl, boy remembers girl, girls dies in a tragic blimp accident over the Orange Bowl on New Year's Day.

by MerryGoByeBye on Jun 17, 2008 12:42 PM EDT 0 recs

By "him," you mean Masterson?

Personally, I want the Sox to ride him until the wheels come off. Let Buchholz get his s* together in AAA and keep his inning total down. I’m fine with Clay coming back after the AS break.

Long-term, I think Masterson could remain a starter. His sinker can be devastating, and his slider is solid. I’d like to see him develop and use his change up a little more, but he can learn that. Brandon Webb does pretty well with a sinker, curve and change-up…

Manny ain't the only bad man.

by tommy.otm on Jun 17, 2008 6:31 PM EDT up 0 recs

IF Masterson get to develop that change-up

I’ll believe he’ll be fine as a starter. However I feel that if he stays a starter, he won’t have much of a chance with us while he would be a dominating setup man (something we clearly don’t have). I like him very much and I really hope he stays in Boston for quite a while, so using him on a trade is not something I’d like. But with Bowden, Buch and Lester also being very young and considering that Beckett and Dice-K are not too old I have a hard time finding a spot for him in the rotation.

One of Masterson and Bowden will be a bullpen guy, I feel. And all things point at Bowden being the better starting pitcher.

It's the same old story. Boy finds girl, boy loses girl, girl finds boy, boy forgets girl, boy remembers girl, girls dies in a tragic blimp accident over the Orange Bowl on New Year's Day.

by MerryGoByeBye on Jun 17, 2008 11:01 PM EDT up 0 recs

I agree

These are nice problems to have.

Manny ain't the only bad man.

by tommy.otm on Jun 17, 2008 11:28 PM EDT up 0 recs

Anyone concerned about his arm slot?

I think Masterson has some great stuff, easily good enough to be a starter with the addition of a change up or another secondary type pitch. My concern is will he be able to last that long with that same sidearm style arm slot? I have been racking my brain trying to think of a present/past starter with a submarine or sidearm pitcher that actually succeeded. (Can anyone think of any?) This makes me want to put him in the bullpen where we can monitor his pitch counts and keep him in the majors (with the Sox of course) without tearing his arm out of the socket.

by drabidea on Jun 19, 2008 12:54 PM EDT up 0 recs

I think the changeup is the bigger concern.

It looks a bit unorthodox, and seems almost counterintuitive to keeping command of his pitches, but his arm slot/delivery doesn’t look stressful/painful to him at all.

"Are you a real doctor, or a doctor like Dr. Pepper is a doctor?"

by Allen Chace on Jun 19, 2008 9:29 PM EDT up 0 recs

Oh, and you know who's hitting very well in Pawtucket?

Joe Thurston. Shit you not. However, I really hope that this doesn’t mean we’ll see him again in the Red Sox.

It's the same old story. Boy finds girl, boy loses girl, girl finds boy, boy forgets girl, boy remembers girl, girls dies in a tragic blimp accident over the Orange Bowl on New Year's Day.

by MerryGoByeBye on Jun 17, 2008 12:44 PM EDT 0 recs

How about trading Colon

Trade him before the deadline for outfield/shortstop/catcher prospects. Of course a package for Huston Street sounds good….

by sox-inda-south on Jun 17, 2008 1:36 PM EDT 0 recs

Sox in the driver's seat

With the Red Sox in 1st place, maintaining depth is important for later in the season and to cover for potential injuries. If the Red Sox want to DL Colon to keep Masterson rolling, I’m fine with that. However, Colon is very valuable as an innings-eater over the course of the season and in September. We actually have the depth to consider a 6-man rotation.

"You know you're having a bad day when the fifth inning rolls around and they drag the warning track." - Mike Flanagan, Baltimore Orioles pitcher, 1992.

by SoxDevil on Jun 17, 2008 1:48 PM EDT 0 recs

And right on cue

the Sox DL Colon.

by 0157H7 on Jun 17, 2008 4:00 PM EDT 0 recs

With the move,

the Sox called up Chris Smith, a 27-yo righty from AAA, who throws a hard curve in the 80s, a 89-93 fastball, and a change-up. Smith has 41.1 innings in AAA this year, mostly as a reliever; his ERA this season is 1.52, with a .195 BA against.

by 0157H7 on Jun 17, 2008 4:22 PM EDT up 0 recs

Interesting...

Rock me, sexy Jesus...

by nuthinboutnuthin on Jun 17, 2008 4:41 PM EDT up 0 recs

I'd rather see Charlie Zink coming up

I got a weakness for knuclers. :)

It's the same old story. Boy finds girl, boy loses girl, girl finds boy, boy forgets girl, boy remembers girl, girls dies in a tragic blimp accident over the Orange Bowl on New Year's Day.

by MerryGoByeBye on Jun 17, 2008 5:08 PM EDT up 0 recs

The problem with Masterson

Will be his innings cap. Last year, he threw 153.2 innings. That means the Sox will likely shut him down at 175 innings this year, including the post-season. So far this year he has thrown 75.1 major and minor league innings. If he makes 17 or 18 more starts and averafes 6 innings a start, he’ll be capped out at the end of the season.

I think the Sox will shift him to the pen later on to keep him available for the playoffs.

I gotta go 'cause I'm probably definitely gonna nod out again.

by Drugs Delaney on Jun 17, 2008 6:33 PM EDT 0 recs

Our Rotation

I have mentioned before and I am still concerned with Wakefield being in the 3 spot. Wakefield is one of my favorite pitchers but he has never succeeded in the 3 spot, even in his prime. We need to find a way to get him back down to the 4 spot as soon as possible. We will have to wait until Dice-K puts in some quality starts in the 4 spot before we can switch him and Wake.

Lester has been amazing all year, especially as of late. I am concerned about getting him some rest too though. He has pitched the most innings this year (96.1) out of any of our pitchers. With 75 games gone by and 2 more till he next pitches that is 77 games out of 162. This projects him to pitch 202.2 innings this year. Keep in mind that last year was the most he pitched in a year with 153.2 innings. It is still early to be concerned but I hope that it is in the mind of Terry and Theo if we want him to pitch effectively in the playoffs.

by drabidea on Jun 19, 2008 1:57 PM EDT 0 recs

Lester threw 9.1 post-season innings too

Making his total last year 163 IP. But your point is well taken. Tito has always been good at resting players, something many criticized him for last season. Hey, they already moved Beckett back a day to get extra rest.

The Sox have a lot of starting pitching: Beckett, Dice-K, Lester, Wake, Masterson, Colon, and Buchholz. I expect all of them to get significant starts, especially in the second half. A six-man rotation in September isn’t out of the question (if all the starters are healthy).

As for who is #3 or #4 in the rotation, right now it doesn’t matter. Coming out of the All-Star Break, the rotation will likely be juggled for match-ups. Any injuries will force changes, as will rest days down the stretch. The order of the rotation really isn’t that important, except, ideally, you want you #1 and #2 to get the most innings. Beckett’s and Dice-K’s injuries have sort of scrapped that. Where it’s important how a team lines up 1 through 4 is in the post-season—and Wake won’t be in the three spot then.

I gotta go 'cause I'm probably definitely gonna nod out again.

by Drugs Delaney on Jun 19, 2008 11:26 PM EDT up 0 recs