Breaking News: Sox Survive to Fight Another Day.

by Allen Chace on Oct 17, 2007 11:47 PM EDT in News Comment 80 comments

I attempted to find a better picture...there really just wasn't one.

(AP Photo/Al Behrman)

Sox avoid fourth straight loss on Wednesday night.

"You know, despite how well the other team is playing and how poorly we've executed some things, it's just nice to know that we have the chance to play another game on Thursday", said Kevin Youkilis, Red Sox first baseman. Youkilis wasn't alone in this sentiment. Many of the Sox players were excited for the opportunity to play on Thursday.
After Josh Beckett's Game 1 win, it all went downhill for the Sox, who suffered what seemed like both figurative and literal knees to the crotch in Games 2, 3, and 4 from the Clevelands.
Dustin Pedroia, Red Sox second baseman, on the mood Wednesday night: "To me, it's just amazing that we're to this point. We've been shitting the bed pretty spectacularly while the [censored] Indians have been doing their [censored] thing, but being able to avoid the loss today was huge."
Sox manager Terry Francona was as upbeat as his infielders: "I'm proud of every one of these guys. I think making sure they feel confident about themselves has helped; I don't think you make change for change's sake. They showed a lot of heart tonight (Wednesday) in forcing another game with that ballclub on Thursday. Hopefully they'll be up to the challenge again tomorrow."
Sox "outfielder", Manny Ramirez, agreed. Sort of. "We're just going to go out there and play. I'm going to hit home runs, and I'm going to pose for the cameras, all at the same time.. Just business as usual over here."
How did the Sox avoid losing Wednesday? The answer, it seems, was hard to pin down for bullpen statesman Jonathan Papelbon. "You know, as I look at Gagne's empty locker, it's hard to figure out one specific Canadian reason why we're still alive after today. Seriously, if you can find Gagne, he might be a better person to ask that question."
Eric Gagne could not be reached for comment.

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Sox Survive to Fight Another Day.

Something to read while we get ready for Beckett.

Bottom 9th B:1 S:0 O:0 With Bill Mueller batting, Dave Roberts steals (1) 2nd base.

by britsoxfan on Oct 18, 2007 5:00 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Most people here know!

I know many cheerleaders on this blog refuse to give up, but the reality of this team is what it is! I do take some heart that the silent majority here is not comatose as indicated by the poll on the main page. That has it about correct, IMHO:

How will the ALCS hash out?

Sox in 4 3%
Sox in 5 9%
Sox in 6 20%
Sox in 7 11%
Indians in 4 2%
Indians in 5 32% *****
Indians in 6 15%
Indians in 7 5%

Maybe a better use of time would be to discuss how this team can be made better next year, and/or who do you think will win the Rockies-Indians World Series!

BTW, Francona must go! He is too stubborn to motivate this team, and he also allows to much individuality (as in anti-Celtic team spirit) to justify his continued presence as the team leader, IMHO!

by NG on Oct 18, 2007 9:01 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Re: Most people here know!

NG, funny how you only show up when things are going bad. Go to hell.

by Matzushocka on Oct 18, 2007 9:34 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Re: Most people here know!

But you see, I am in the majority, not you. Again see poll! Now who should "go to hell"?

I am not a brainless fan who salutes and roots blindly. I want a winner, and am willing to speak my mind when I see real deficiencies that are in the way of that goal. Are you?? This is a team that had a 14 game lead at one point, and then almost gave that up in a monumental but oh so common slide. Now instead of peaking when it counts, they continue the unabated slide with little effort to stem it from management. How can any of you not be angry?

by NG on Oct 18, 2007 10:19 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Re: Most people here know!

Had the Sox shared your mentality three years ago, the Curse would still be alive.

And the fact that the MFY played over their heads the entire second half of the season had something to do with giving up that huge lead. The Sox weren't that much better in the first half.

by RSNexile on Oct 18, 2007 5:02 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Re: Most people here know!

"Cheerleaders" = Fans
NG = Someone who watches baseball but who is absolutely not a fan

Whenever someone uses "silent majority", it sets my teeth on edge. These are the green ink brigade who write, on average, three letters a week to their local newspaper.

Bottom 9th B:1 S:0 O:0 With Bill Mueller batting, Dave Roberts steals (1) 2nd base.

by britsoxfan on Oct 18, 2007 9:47 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Re: Most people here know!

I don't agree - I think they have a real shot. Cleveland has to cool off and we have it lined up the right way with our pitchers.

Read a great piece on Elsbury at blog.fanboom.com

by JohnnyFB on Oct 18, 2007 10:06 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Re: Most people here know!

I think others have pointed out some of the other things I'd like to say, but the simple fact of the matter with that poll, NG, is that we've had a fair few visitors from LGT lately. I'm guessing it's many of those visitors (and not some made-up silent majority of Sox fans) that made those votes.

by Allen Chace on Oct 18, 2007 10:36 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Re: Most people here know!

Let me ask you Allen, do you think a real "fan" should always root positively for the team no matter what the reality, and never criticise what may be obvious problems to that fan?? What is the definition of a normal, as oppose to an abnormal fan??

I must have watched 95% of the sox games this year, and I always started out wanting them to win. It's true! Does that make me a troll or a plant.

When they let me down, I was disappointed and even angry because I put in my time with good intentions, but I do not believe many overpaid players or sox management did the same. So as a loyal fan to the idea of sox winning (for God knows what reasons), I express myself when my objectives are not being met. If you guys are really satisfied and upbeat with this teams effort the last weak, then I want some of your medicines. So to me, the reality of the poll is just that--reality no matter who voted!

by NG on Oct 18, 2007 10:49 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Re: Most people here know!

No, I do not. I think real fans can feel any way that want at any given time, though I think if it ends up being a mostly negative experience one should walk away.

I think most of the problem people here have with you is that you mostly pop up when things are going bad like this. How about the Buchholz no-hitter? The day Beckett won 20? All the great things from Pedroia, Lowell, Papi, Youkilis this season.

I have no problem with people being realistic about the team, but the reality is that this team is tough, they haven't given up, and they're, IMHO, as talented as the other team. The other team has just, to this point, played better than we have. I have no problem acknowledging that. I don't know what the point is in harping on it for people who know it and don't want to spend a whole lot of time thinking about how unsuccessful we've been the last three games. No one here is blinding themselves to that truth.

It's not about being satisfied and upbeat with this team's effort the last week. It's about being satisfied and upbeat with this team's effort over the course of the whole season which makes us feel like we have at least a slim chance. I don't feel there's anything wrong with that.

And the poll is skewed, I'm guessing, towards many of the Indians fans who have visited here, making it an extremely unreliable measure of the pulse of OTM Sox fans.

by Allen Chace on Oct 18, 2007 10:55 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Re: Most people here know!

I guess I personally do not need an outlet when my objectives are being met. I find the need to vent when I am disappointed, and I am now EXTEMELY DISAPPOINTED WITH THIS TEAM AND THIS MANAGEMENT!

I see many areas where actions could have made the outcome better. As a fan that takes precedent over the mindless rooting at least for me.

Finally and to the point I guess, do you know of a different forum where more openly objective and thinking folks discuss the Sox??

by NG on Oct 18, 2007 11:09 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Re: Most people here know!

Considering that thinly veiled "criticism" of us here, I'm not sure what impetus I could possibly have for trying to find you a forum with more people who think as you do.

by Allen Chace on Oct 18, 2007 12:06 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Re: Most people here know!

NG, here you go.

Perfect forum for you.

Manny Ramirez is a bad man

by tommy.otm on Oct 18, 2007 12:09 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Re: Most people here know!

Apparently a forum for like-minded "fans" isn't so hard to find. :)

by Allen Chace on Oct 18, 2007 12:29 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Re: Most people here know!

How can you be disappointed? The Sox had the best record in the AL! What do you want, a perfect season?

Don't become a Yankee fan -- they're only happy if they win everything and any other result is abject failure. That's no way to go through life. Yankees fans are generally miserable creatures. Pitiful.

I think we can definitely take this series but if we don't ... it was still a very good season and I really enjoyed it. Bitching and moaning may be part of being a fan but you can't let it rule the day.

If we don't win this series, I think it comes down to the underperforming trio of Lugo, Crisp and Drew, a problem we've had all year. But at a certain point, you have to rely on your guys, you know? And if they don't get it done, there's not much more that you can do. There's a fine line between making a good replacement and snap judgments. What if the FO had replaced Pedroia at the beginning of the season? Would the Sox have even made the post season without him?

As for the situation now, Ellsbury can't play three positions ;) I'd like to see him come in for Drew but at a certain point, Crisp and Lugo have to contribute or we face elimination. So you tip your cap and say, Cleveland timed it better. They had momentum when we had none.

But Beckett is going to swing the pedulum the other way tonight.

by dave in CT on Oct 18, 2007 12:10 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Kudos Dave. Kudos.

by Allen Chace on Oct 18, 2007 12:15 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Re: Most people here know!

Dave, nice try, but it is like this. If you are having sex and almost climax but not quite, are you satisfied?? I want a world series victory, a climax for my fan efforts! Nothing less! For the amount of payroll the sox currently have, we should have it or heads should roll. If that is what Yankee fans demand, then I like it!

by NG on Oct 18, 2007 12:52 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Re: Most people here know!

Sorry NG, but I really don't want to think about you doin it.

Manny Ramirez is a bad man

by tommy.otm on Oct 18, 2007 1:01 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Re: Most people here know!

Holy crap this is a really uncomfortable comparison.

Also, if you fail to climax, you can always try again. I think that's what Manny was getting at.

by Allen Chace on Oct 18, 2007 1:09 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Re: Most people here know!

You want to tell that to NG's partner?

by RSNexile on Oct 18, 2007 5:05 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Re: Most people here know!

"I guess I personally do not need an outlet when my objectives are being met. I find the need to vent when I am disappointed"

Doesn't sound like you are looking for a forum to objectively discuss the sox like you claim, but just want one to vent. Sorry, but this site isn't for venting, it's for objectively discussing the sox, as much as you may claim it is not.

Is it just me or is it hypocritial to say you want somewhere to objectively discuss sox when you yourself said you only post when you are disappointed? Isn't only posting negative comments the, and ignoring/being silent about positives the exact opposite of being objective?

by Realistic on Oct 18, 2007 1:20 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Re: Most people here know!

by Allen Chace on Oct 18, 2007 1:23 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Re: Most people here know!

I guess the overwhelming "happy talk" around here leads me to not feel the need to be a groupie in this endeavor. I take it for granted that the main MODERN objective of a sox fan is winning the World Series, and when that objective is threatened, I feel the need to respond. When it is not, I do not feel a response from me is critical, maybe nice to do, but not critical! Maybe that is a personal weakness I have!

by NG on Oct 18, 2007 1:28 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Re: Most people here know!

Personal weakness.

Something that ultimately, completely damages any credibility you might've had with this community.

Potato, potahto.

by Allen Chace on Oct 18, 2007 1:30 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Re: Most people here know!

Allan, credibility with the community is not my goal. I would rather be correct with my assessments most of the time than credible with the community. If my assessments were correct and overlooked, I did my job. If my assessments were wrong, I deserve criticism.

Overall, I think my assessments of the sox weaknesses this year have been borne out, and will be borne out. Just read all the vielded comments in this thread about the major sox weaknesses. Do we want a world series champion or not?? Hopefully these weaknesses can then be dealt with for the future. Happy talk does nothing for the future.

by NG on Oct 18, 2007 1:41 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Re: Most people here know!

If you weren't concered with credibility, you wouldn't post here.

Ostensibly, if you don't care about whether we read your words and (potentially) agree or at least consider them for a few minutes, you're just as well yelling them in an abandoned warehouse somewhere.

by Allen Chace on Oct 18, 2007 1:50 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Re: Most people here know!

Time will tell!

by NG on Oct 18, 2007 1:54 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Re: Most people here know!

I agree. NG, if you don't care why not just email yourself these negative thoughts instead of posting here? Your sexual comparison's might go over better there anyhow.

by Matzushocka on Oct 18, 2007 2:29 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Re: Most people here know!

Oh my God! Negative thoughts about the Red Sox on this Blog. I am so sorry. Won't happen again.

NOT

Happy now?

by NG on Oct 18, 2007 2:35 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Re: Most people here know!

email urself

by Matzushocka on Oct 18, 2007 2:43 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Re: Breaking News: Sox Survive to Fight Another Da

the problem is not Francona. (BTW, the importance of baseball managers is generally overstated. But I disgress.)

The problems with games 3 and 4 are simple: not enough hitting. And we've seen enough of that in '07 to realize it's an endemic problem. Lugo, Crisp, and Drew are all relatively weak hitters for their positions.

Dice-K and Wakefield both pitched pretty much the same way they did most of the season. Dice-K needs to really revamp his focus/get better command of his fastball. That won't come quickly, but it is something he may be able to pull off for next season. Wake is just, well, a bit creaky.

(As for Game 2 - there's little to say about an 11-inning game other than, well, somebody is going to eventually lose.)

I don't know why anybody would discuss next year already when we have a starter tonight who is red-hot facing a starter who has failed miserably in his past two postseason starts. Just let things happen as they do and stop trying to get ahead of bad news.

by RickD on Oct 18, 2007 9:38 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs

hey

Hey, if Beckett wins tonight it'd be cool. At least one more game at the fens. & maybe Ellsbury will get a chance to drive a run in or 2 from the bottom of the order... Or possibly even lead off & set the table for the middle.

by kevindineen on Oct 18, 2007 9:50 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Re: hey

Remember like a month ago when Ellsbury was our leadoff hitter and PedROYa hit second and we won a bunch of games?

That was cool.

Manny Ramirez is a bad man

by tommy.otm on Oct 18, 2007 10:30 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Re: hey

Good times.

Have you guys seen the photoshop job over on Dirt Dogs -- the ER spoof? It is hilarious and spot on.

by dave in CT on Oct 18, 2007 10:45 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Uhhhh

Uhhhh, Papelbon?

Manny Ramirez is a bad man

by tommy.otm on Oct 18, 2007 10:49 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Re: Uhhhh

Body of an elephant. Brain of... an elephant.

Bottom 9th B:1 S:0 O:0 With Bill Mueller batting, Dave Roberts steals (1) 2nd base.

by britsoxfan on Oct 18, 2007 10:55 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Re: Uhhhh

Disturbing. Even more disturbing that Manny doesn't seem to be fazed by this behavior.

by dave in CT on Oct 18, 2007 12:12 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Re: Uhhhh

Must be REALLY boring out there in the 'pen.

BC14

by BC14 on Oct 18, 2007 12:31 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Re: Uhhhh

Or like, WAY too interesting.

Uncomfortably interesting.

by Allen Chace on Oct 18, 2007 12:31 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

My rant.

We need to start Ellsbury for game 6 IF there is a game 6. The only reason Im opposed to it tonight is because obviously CC's pitching. Lead off Jacoby, 2nd would be Scrappy, then bat Youk further down in the order. I want to say congrats to the Indians. I do not think we will make a comeback in this series (hope I am wrong).
The Tribe has not only played well, but they have also been on the rec. end of several lucky breaks. That's not a knock, because whoever wins every October needs the lucky breaks (see Holiday, Matt not touching plate). I can't help but think Buchholz possibly giving us two starts in the ALCS might have been a difference maker?
BTW in the event of game 7, Id pitch Lester.

If we do go on and lose this series, it will be because we blew a GREAT opportunity in game 2. And because the Tribe's bullpen has been fantastic. Ill be so happy if we never see Gagne again, but I cannot fault the move because NOBODY would have predicted his awful play here.

Coco is going to be traded, however I dont know what if anything we will get for him. His defense, great, but his speed doesn't mean shit if he can't get on base.

Drew, well I don't think we can move his contract. I do not want to see another year of Nancy in 2008. He has hurt this team incredibly bad, and that might be the negative story of the season.

Lugo, is the only one of the "automatics" I will not mind seeing in 2008. I think he had a nice second half. Lugo's defense also was well above what I expected of him.

Now the question is, do we give Lowell more than a 2 year deal? I love the guy, but more than two years is a huge risk. I think Philly, and some other teams might line up to give him 3-5 years at big $$$. The A-Rod thing will be talked about, I was all for it before but have seen Boars wants 400 million or some BS like that. So thanks, but no thanks. This will be interesting to see unfold.

We need to go out in FA/Trades this off season and acquire 1. A proven #2 starting pitcher. (No faith in dice K, hope I am wrong) 2. Figure out the 3rd base situation. 3. A proven, power hitting Right Fielder. 4. A catcher of the future. 5. Someone who can step in and play CF in the event Jacoby isnt the "real deal" (NOT CRISP) 6. Bullpen, Bullpen, Bullpen...because you can never have enough.

Go Sox Tonight. Its been a fun ride this season no matter what. Thanks.

by Matzushocka on Oct 18, 2007 11:07 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Re: My rant.

***boras

by Matzushocka on Oct 18, 2007 11:10 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Re: My rant.

Now that IS the fan spirit for me--optimistic but critical when and where needed. Good rant, and I hope you feel better because of it

by NG on Oct 18, 2007 11:14 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Re: My rant.

I can't see them getting another RF. I fear we're stuck with Drew for a couple more years, at least. But if we were looking for another OFer, I'm intrigued by Carlos Quentin - terrible year this year, but still a lot of promise. And since the D-backs have resigned Byrnes to a long-term deal, he seems expendable.

As for 3b, I'm curious how the Atkins/Stewart thing will shake out in Colorado. There's talk one of them will move to 2b, but maybe they'd be open to trades as well.

Manny Ramirez is a bad man

by tommy.otm on Oct 18, 2007 11:42 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Re: My rant.

Id like to see us get a proven AL power bat...somewhere.

by Matzushocka on Oct 18, 2007 12:15 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Re: My rant.

Garrett Atkins, this season, was basically Jason Varitek (.773 OPS) away from Coors Field.

by Allen Chace on Oct 18, 2007 12:20 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Re: My rant.

June 14, 2007:

Rox v. Sox

Garrett Atkins:3B

5 ABs, 3 hits, 4 RBIs, 0 Ks 0 BB 0 .242

Final score: 7-1 Rox
.......................

Now, I'll grant you, he's not a guy to fear every time he steps up, but I recall watching this game locally in Denver, and I kept wondering aloud, "Who in the name of heaven is this Garret Atkins?"

And this particular game was Beckett's 1st loss of the season.

I curse the name Garrett Atkins.

And for the record, he didn't do very well at bat in the first 2 games against the Sox. I think he went something like 1 for 7 in the 2 games prior to this one.

BC14

by BC14 on Oct 18, 2007 12:29 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Re: My rant.

I wasn't trying to say he's worthless. But I mean, if we're going to get an .800 OPS max from 3B next season, I'd like to get someone who's not a butcher with the glove. (89 Rate2 according to BP. Yuck.)

by Allen Chace on Oct 18, 2007 12:31 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Re: My rant.

Oh, I didn't take it that way at all, Allen - it's just that when I saw his name, I was turning my teeth to powder from remembering how he'd hit so well against JB in that game. In Denver, you'd have thought he was Ted Williams, the way the local media were carrying on about him.

BC14

by BC14 on Oct 18, 2007 4:29 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Atkins

Oddly, he hit five more homeruns away than he did at home, but his batting average was a hundred points higher at home (I say "oddly" because the team as a whole hit 40 more homeruns at Coors than they did on the road). His BABIP at home was .372, versus .261 on the road, which suggests luck had something to do with the disparity between home and away numbers. This 110 point swing is 70 points higher than the difference of the team as a whole.

Of course, Fenway is still something of a hitter's park as well. And Mike Lowell's OPS away from Fenway was .767.

The biggest difference between the two is defense. Lowell is one of the best, and some think Atkins is below average.

Manny Ramirez is a bad man

by tommy.otm on Oct 18, 2007 12:44 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Re: My rant.

Sign Lowell for more than two? I say yes. If for nothing else than his leadership abilities. I think there's often too much emphasis on a guy's numbers and not enough on intangibles like character, and Lowell is LOADED with great character.

by dave in CT on Oct 18, 2007 12:16 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Re: My rant.

Coco: only plays because of defense.

Drew: only plays because we have no other options, doubtful we can move him, stuck with him.

Lugo: see drew, but not on such a grand "sucks" scale.

mirabelli: only keep him cause of catching wake.

I don't want to sign Lowell for more than two years because of leadership. I agree he is a great guy, but I don't want to give him 4 years because of that. I want to get an impact position player this off season. This will make it a lil more tolerable if Drew,Lugo and Tek continue to struggle w/ the bat.
Are we going to get the same production from Lowell next year as this year? We also can't forget the MFY's awful start helped us big time this year, when at times our bats were silent. I know Papi and Manny had "down" years, but Id still feel comfortable with another masher in this lineup.

by Matzushocka on Oct 18, 2007 12:46 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Does Manny's comments show a good

team spirit.

Look at this Yahoo story:

http://sports.yahoo.com/mlb/news?slug=ti-mannytoo101707&prov=yhoo&type=lgns

If you were being paid the kind of money that this guy makes in any other field of human endeavor, could you possible get away with such a lax attitude.

Now people, that is what angers me about much of this team!

by NG on Oct 18, 2007 1:05 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

.462/.611/.923

That's Manny's Avg/OBP/SLG. His OPS is 1534. He is having one of the best hitting post-seasons in history. And your mad at him because he's not fazed by being down in the series, and he doesn't sound like he's gonna jump off the Tobin if we lose tonite.

This is what angers me about your comments. You're just looking for stuff to complain about.

Manny Ramirez is a bad man

by tommy.otm on Oct 18, 2007 1:11 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Re: .462/.611/.923

Tommy, the crux of the debate is/was TEAM SPIRIT! I have been harping lately about how motivation and emotion are the keys to winning in the postseason. The 2004 Sox showed the power of igniting such emotion at just the correct time. When Manny acts as a show of one and gets away with lack of hussle that would be demanded of any other player, he deflates that emotional spirit in others, IMO. That is why despite his strong showing on the field in many respects, he is not a good team player which hurts all teams. Maybe he should take up golf!

by NG on Oct 18, 2007 1:17 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Re: .462/.611/.923

I'm really confused now? Team spirit?

I thought what we needed if we were going to win the next three is this.

Shutdown performances from Beckett, Schilling, and Daisuke
Continuation of what has been mostly good BP work from everyone but MDC (who just had two poor games in the postseason amidst having a couple good ones now and MANY good ones in the regular season), J-Lo and Gagne (who should be "missing" in action)
Guys getting on-base ahead of Papi, Manny, and Lowell, all of whom have hit pretty well.

If we just needed team spirit to win, we'd have a team full of Kevin Millars and Eric Byrneses. We don't. We have a bunch of guys with a lot of talent. They have a bunch of guys with a lot of talent.

Btw, our two most successful postseason performers thusfar (Beckett and Manny) have been completely devoid of the kind of emotion you're looking for. Explain it. Now.

by Allen Chace on Oct 18, 2007 1:21 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Re: .462/.611/.923

Allan, the final results will speak to this issue! Look back to 2004 and try to find the spark. Imagine if that could be kindled again.

One guy can never do it all, but you got to excite the spirit of the team. Manny needs to show more team spirit or his lack of caring will (and probably has) rub off.

by NG on Oct 18, 2007 1:33 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Re: .462/.611/.923

Again, I say, the guys on the Sox who have done the best are the ones who have been able to treat these games like any other.

David Ortiz was successful for us in 2004, because, well, he was successful most of the season.

Coco Crisp, J.D. Drew, and Julio Lugo have all been slightly disappointing-very disappointing with the bats because, well, they've been that way all season.

I think raw emotion is getting in the way of Dustin Pedroia being the hitter he really is.

Also, the real Allan runs his own blog.

by Allen Chace on Oct 18, 2007 1:37 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Re: .462/.611/.923

Btw, that was me correcting a misspelling that people have done all my life.

Not some kind of bizarro invitation for you to sling this crap over there.

by Allen Chace on Oct 18, 2007 1:38 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Sorry

I will try to get AllEn correct.

by NG on Oct 18, 2007 1:48 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Re: Sorry

People do it all the time. Just a pet peeve.

by Allen Chace on Oct 18, 2007 1:49 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Re: .462/.611/.923

Manny was the World Series MVP in 2004, and he had the same attitude or "spirit" as he does now

by Realistic on Oct 18, 2007 1:43 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Lemme get this straight

When people around here "cheerlead" (you word, not mine), this evidences our lack of objectivity. When our best hitter gives a sober assessment of the season and says in essence "we've just got to go out, have fun, and give our best shot," this evidences a lack of team spirit.

Manny Ramirez is a bad man

by tommy.otm on Oct 18, 2007 1:39 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Re: Lemme get this straight

I think you know better than this. When Manny stands around watching his potential homerun instead of running right away to only end up with a single or to be thrown out at second, than is detrimental to team results and team spirit. You know that kind of behavior if it was condoned with all the team would be totally unacceptable. So obviously, Manny gets a "bye" on criticism here, and that "bye" results in unfair and uneven team team treatment, expectations,and resentment from others. That results in poor team spirit and makes for managerial uneasiness, IMO! Then to say "who cares" if they loses because I got my millions, well come on, wake up!

by NG on Oct 18, 2007 2:01 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

"I think you know better than this."

I should know better than to try understand your negativity. Now your saying that the reason our team spirit is deflated, causing us to lose the playoffs, is that Manny screwed up on the base paths like three or four months ago and was insufficiently chastised. Or something.

You've been all doom and gloom since you showed up here in like May, predicting our inevitable and imminent slide. Now it's like five months later, and the Sox won the division, claimed their place as one of the two best teams in the AL, and you're smugly declaring you've been vindicated in your multiple predictions of an inevitable slide because we might lose in the ALCS.

Baseball should be fun. And posting about baseball on this blog should be fun. Everyone who comes here knows what's going on with the Sox, we know this is a flawed team (which team isn't...), and most of us will be disappointed if it ends tonight, or Saturday, but we're trying to enjoy ourselves. We don't need you saying "I told you so," when in reality, you didn't. And we certainly don't need your thoughts on bad sex.

Anyways...

Manny Ramirez is a bad man

by tommy.otm on Oct 18, 2007 7:12 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Re: Lemme get this straight

"in unfair and uneven team team treatment, "

................

Have you ever looked at the salaries? Why is Player X making more than Player Y ?

Gosh, that's unfair! It's ... it's.. UNEVEN!

Wake up and smell the roses.

BC14

by BC14 on Oct 19, 2007 11:47 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Re: .462/.611/.923

Gee, and all this time I thought it was hitting and good defense (which includes pitching) that won games - post-season or otherwise.

BC14

by BC14 on Oct 18, 2007 4:25 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Re: Does Manny's comments show a good

Kinda like tommy said above, with how well Manny has performed, I think we could do with more of our players taking his attitude.

by Allen Chace on Oct 18, 2007 1:12 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Re: Does Manny's comments show a good

Dude, its the media taking advantage of someone whose English still isnt the greatest. Manny is very easy going, and this right here is why dude don't talk to media.

by Matzushocka on Oct 18, 2007 1:27 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Re: Does Manny's comments show a good

I happen to agree with Manny.

If the Sox don't go to the WS, the sun will still come up (in the East, even), and it won't be the end of the world.

NG, are you suggesting that it WOULD be the end of the world?

Team spirit? LOL Ah, yes, I remember my high school days...

BC14

by BC14 on Oct 18, 2007 4:24 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Sox Survive to Fight Another Day.

Don't know how all you feel about Bill Simmons...but I could not get through his diary without spitting my coke out...brilliant. It is exactly how I feel and dead on...

http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/page2/story?page=simmons/071016

by cblesz on Oct 18, 2007 2:23 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Beckett Not Healthy?

My friend in Cleveland says the local sports scene there is running rampant with a rumor that JB is still ailing from his game 1 appearance, (recall that he was pulled due to some stiffness)...

.. anyone else heard anything along those lines?

BC14

by BC14 on Oct 18, 2007 4:23 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Re: Beckett Not Healthy?

Time to call it a season if this is 1% true

by Matzushocka on Oct 18, 2007 4:37 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Re: Beckett Not Healthy?

I'm guessing they're blowing it out of proportion, though I know he was pulled at 80 pitches with no intention of keeping him fresh for Game 4.

Sounds like the break between inning 6 and inning 7 ended up being too long and his back stiffened a bit. I highly doubt we'd be throwing him if there was any possibility of the words "offseason back surgery" being in his vocabulary in the next few days.

by Allen Chace on Oct 18, 2007 4:49 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Re: Beckett Not Healthy?

Weather.com is calling for temps in the low 70s (right now) and falling to just high 60s (67) by 9PM. So, there isn't an issue with cold weather, and that's good.

I'm still wondering, though, about this. Of course, nothing to do but wait and see how he does.

As for the ex girlfiend singing - whoop de doo.

BC14

by BC14 on Oct 18, 2007 6:11 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Re: Beckett Not Healthy?

It's been quietly discussed, but I wonder if it might be some gamesmanship on the part of Francona...
LINK

Honestly, I'd be more concerned about this...

Beckett's ex to sing National Anthem

And somehow the Indians front office is denying any prior knowledge of the relationship. Somehow, I don't think this is a coincidence.

by Spidey on Oct 18, 2007 5:07 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Re: Beckett Not Healthy?

Even in jest, I'm not sure why we or Josh Beckett would be concerned about this. Would he blink if Alyssa Milano were in the stands or threw out the first pitch in a postseason game? Would Leeann Tweeden interviewing him completely change the plan he and Varitek have for attacking the Indians' hitters tonight?

by Allen Chace on Oct 18, 2007 5:16 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Re: Beckett Not Healthy?

To extend what I've already said, this would almost seem like a clever move if against someone who's been proven to be a bit fragile mentally.

Josh Beckett = not in that category.

Now, if we still had D-Lowe and you put either his ex-wife or that LAD reporter doing the anthem...

by Allen Chace on Oct 18, 2007 6:14 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Re: Beckett Not Healthy?

It is pretty lame, isn't it?

Wasn't there an episode of "The Simpsons" with the estranged wife of the star player for the Isotopes singing the anthem?

Pretty lame, Cleveland, pretty lame.

BC14

by BC14 on Oct 18, 2007 6:44 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Re: Beckett Not Healthy?

To be fair to Cleveland, I think this whole "organization picked her as a replacement to f--- with Beckett's head" is probably trumped up by the media.

by Allen Chace on Oct 18, 2007 6:55 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs